Science - Why is Apologia Elementary not used until Year 3?

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Science - Why is Apologia Elementary not used until Year 3?

Unread post by cbollin » Wed Jan 25, 2006 3:39 am

TommyGirl wrote:I am new to MFW and I am so excited to be here! I just want to say thank you to the Hazells for creating this for all of us. The focus and the heart of it is so God-honoring.

My question involves science. I know that the science seems to be integrated into the other subjects we are studying. However, I have looked at Apologia elementary science and absolutely loves the way it looks. I noticed that MFW does use Apologia Creation, but not until year three. I was wondering if there was a reason for using it so late in the cycle. Is it too difficult a program to be used with earlier ages?

For the first question you ask, why was it so late in the cycle. Maybe because of the publication dates from Apologia. If I remember this correctly, Exploring Creation Astronomy was published in summer of 2004. The Botany book was released shortly after that.

I'm using the Astronomy book this year with a 4th grader with a 1st grader watching. My personal opinion is that the book is geared for upper elementary ages (3rd-6th ish) but that younger siblings will enjoy it. In other words, if my oldest were 1st grade, I'd hold off on the book. I just think that the information is better understood once they are a little older.

And, I also like how it fits in with Rome to the Reformation. There's just some neat connection to looking at the stars and planets and realizing that the people we are studying in the middle ages were just studying about the same science too. The real Wow! moment came for us last week. Grandparents bought us a nice telescope for Christmas. It has been a bit cloudy recently at night. But we did get to see Saturn through the telescope and yes, we saw the rings! The "magnitude" of the event was lost on the 1st grader -- but the 4th grader understood enough history about daVinci and Galileo and telescopes to have a Wow learning moment. Again, it was one of those many times that I give God the credit for timing everything in our school life.

I have one friend who is using the Astronomy book for her not-especially-advanced middle and high school girls and they are learning science -- at last (as the mom puts it) and enjoying it.

In general notes here... we're a science and math orientated family (dh is a phd chemist at a university). We have really been enjoying the science presentation that the Hazells have put together. It is a wonderful blend of general science knowledge with age appropriate experiments at the lower elementary age.


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Unread post by Julie in MN » Wed Jan 25, 2006 8:56 am

Yes, I think Crystal is right about the late publication of Apologia. I believe Marie "discovered" Jeannie Fulbright's Astronomy even before it was an Apologia product. And then when Botony came out, it was immediately incorporated into MFW.

However, MFW has chosen another zoology course, probably because the Apologia course is going to be several books long (the first one is only about birds & bugs & flying creatures), and they are not all written yet.

My suggestion would be to try the MFW science as-is, since you have already paid for it and it is all planned out for you. Then if you feel the need to add, you will have Plan B ready for you. I think it will depend a lot on how many other things you are doing. If you are in a co-op or go on field trips or have a day off each week for family chores, you of course will have less room to add curriculum.

And wasn't Crystal's "scientific" viewpoint helpful?! I always find it comforting when an "expert" confirms that this is what they have chosen, also -- thanks Crystal :o)
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Unread post by Lucy » Wed Jan 25, 2006 12:58 pm

They are definitely upper elementary and much more technical than the lower graders in MFW. We are doing the Botany book this year and did the Astronomy book last year. I would stick with the science in Adventures as many lessons help to solidify one of the names of Jesus. Such as when you study Jesus as living water, the rock, and the bread of life those same concepts are studied in a concrete way through science.

They are great books but I think unless you have an extreamly advanced student that they would be overwhelmed with information which would be better presented later.

wife to Lee and mom to Twila 18 (girl) and Noel 16(boy). Happy MFW user since 2002.

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Thank you!

Unread post by TommyGirl » Wed Jan 25, 2006 8:52 pm

Thank you so much for all of your replies! I can't tell you how much I have appreciated reading this forum and seeing all the helpful responses. This helps to give me direction with Science and allows me the freedom to let Apologia go for a little while. I am sure the Hazells did an excellent job of putting their science together and I really like the idea of it being so integrated with the other things we are studying. Thanks again!
Tiffini - Mom to Riley (10), Twins Isaac and Eva (7) (currently using ECC, have used 1st Grade and ADV)


Re: Apologia Elementary Science

Unread post by cbollin » Tue Oct 20, 2009 6:38 am

Angie wrote:My dd is doing MFW 1st this year, she is 6 years old. I have a background in science and want to go deeper in science with dd than the curriculum calls for - not complaining, this curriculum is great, just a personal preference. Anyway, I am interested in using the Apologia curriculum. I noticed that during the five year cycle the Astronomy and Botany books are used. Has anyone incorporated the 3 Zoology books into their MFW curriculum?
If you want to add science, and you have a science background.... can you listen to my story a minute?

I wanted to do the same thing to my oldest. My husband was wise enough to stop me from adding 2 full programs of science to a young child. We were ruining our kid's love for science, and definitely teaching over her head for her stage of learning. So, please don't make the same mistakes on that like I did. I don't know your background in science. I know my husband's. He holds a PHD in inorganic chemistry and works as a researcher. So, I'm just saying, we are a science family and academic geeks.

So, speaking as a science family to another science family --- if you want to go deeper in science, add in control ways on the topic you are learning. How?

If you use the apologia zoology elementary books, use them as reference and extra. (Not really sure how those topics would fit in the MFW first grade science topics, so you might need to wait a year on them, unless you use them to help with the weekly nature walks. then it makes sense.). Don't try to do everything from all books that you have. Don't teach so much that by jr. high years, they think they've learned it all and are turned off by science. Plus, if you use MFW for a long time, you are going to get animal studies in there in several years. So, don't feel the rush to do an entire Zoology book in a year either. Also, take note of the ages of your child when using the book. Although multi level, it helps when you have an older child in them.

Your child is in first grade this year: how many of the science reading books are you using each week on the topic? There is a library list to help add in controlled ways. Are you using those books? Nothing is wrong with doing more reading on a topic. If you want more depth to the topic, then add age appropriate library books on that topic. If your library doesn't have any of those titles, ask the children's librarian for help located the correct dewey number for science topic.

Are you doing the nature walks as is mentioned in the 1st grade manual? You have a science background, so I don't have to explain the importance of nature walks as a way to develop observation skills. Journals are nice, and so are digital cameras. Maybe if you use the books you mentioned, it will help you to remember to do walks. (that's mentioned on page 6 in my first grade manual)

Does your child want more experiments in science? (who doesn't want more physics stuff?) -- add in some fun experiment books (such as those written by Janice Van Cleave and found in most libraries) and just have fun with them.

or participate in a science fair or something like that.
and go to lots of field trip places! (you will never get this time back to do all of that)

Make it more about enjoying science and keeping the fun. still speaking science geeks to science families here: make sure you cover several topics in science in early years to capture their interest. If you use a single topic books (such as zoology for a whole year or 3 volumes...) what if they aren't interested at all in that, but would have loved to have a book on chemistry? So, it's a good thing to give the kids exposure to many things that science has to offer.

Add in controlled ways, that don't overwhelm your day or your child. If you add more curriculum, give yourself permission to not do all of it. Save some for the years in MFW when you have other animal studies (such as there is a short bird unit in ADV like Cheryl said), and then ECC - lots of animals, habitats, ecosystems. CTG: more birds and some animals too. EX1850: full semester on taxonomy. Then even in 7th grade, General Science -- you have a little bit more taxonomy.

Hope some of that helps you to think about big picture of adding more and some practical ideas to do so in controlled ways, especially at this age.


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Re: Apologia Elementary Science

Unread post by Julie in MN » Tue Oct 20, 2009 8:20 am

Angie wrote:I am interested in using the Apologia curriculum. I noticed that during the five year cycle the Astronomy and Botany books are used. Has anyone incorporated the 3 Zoology books into their MFW curriculum?
Hi Angie,
I know there are folks around here who have done this. Maybe they will chime in.

But I just wanted to reinforce one thing. I've read about excited folks on several different boards who try using Apologia with little ones. My observation is that MANY get discouraged. It's a little much for their attention span until around 4th grade or so, or of course a younger sibling who enjoys riding on the coattails of a sibling just a little bit older. Of course every family is different, but if you do try it and have any trouble, just know that as your child gets older, these books will have even more appeal!
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Re: Apologia Elementary Science

Unread post by niki » Tue Oct 20, 2009 1:32 pm

I am one who has used it on and off...honestly, we love the Flying Creatures book and I used it over THREE years! I did the MFW science, but found other times to fit it in... sometimes it was a day science wasn't scheduled... there was a time where my kids would listen and want to listen about the birds for days and days... then they'd get distracted after some lessons and I'd just put it away for a while. I think they gleaned some good info and they have a serious love of nature, animals especially, that's the main reason I got my hands on it when we started ADV. So on and off from ADV through CTG we'd pull out the book - also during the summer you could just read a loud from it. I agree with Julie, that it can be too much for younger elementary, but I used it for a span of 2nd - 4th grade. HTH

Post Posted Tue Dec 15, 2009 12:02 pm by niki
Hi, I used Flying Creatures hit or miss starting in ADV...only when we had extra time, or the kids were interested in more. I also used it over the summer because we had lots of bugs to look at from our reading. I didn't do the entire book, but I enjoyed what we did and I'm looking forward to Botany and Astronomy this year as we do RTR. I, like you, love the Apologia books, BUT, learned that I can't do it all...even all that is good! So that's why I bought it and found I could used it as leisure - it's ok to use school books for non-school time! You could even have it sitting in your book basket!? The text and pictures are great (but you already know that) :)

Anyway, just my 2cents. HTH

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Re: Apologia Elementary Science

Unread post by cbollin » Thu Oct 22, 2009 3:51 pm

Angie wrote:Thank you for all the replies, I appreciate it. Crystal, I appreciate your insight. In answer to your questions we get every title listed in the MFW 1st book list (unless one is not available at the library) and we read them all at least once. We do a lot of nature walks too and really enjoy those times as well. I have not done the journaling formally but we have a lot of discussion about how things are changing with the season at our local parks, etc.
by the way....
I think you are doing a great job with it! Even just walking with them in parks and observing -- that's great. the occasional camera tour can be fun. or if they bring home a pine cone or acorn, or even an occasional slug (that's my middle child..... who does that), or a huge caterpillar that will become a luna moth!, then grab a book from library on it --- they'll remember a lot and learn a lot.

Isn't it hard when we love a subject and have a passion about it to hold back our wish to teach more when they are young. If your child acts for more and is anything like my kids -- let them do it again and suggest small tweaks on an assignment. Encourage them to be creative and think of other ways to do the project or something.

I don't know if you've done MFW K or not --- but you might consider in the spring getting the Butterfly garden kit or ant hill thing. Those are fun.
Angie wrote:So in preparation for next year, assuming I'll continue with Adv., does the science get a little more detailed than 1st? Can anyone tell me a little about what to expect from Adv. Science?
It stays at the concrete level needed for 7 year old children. you can add more if they are interested and motivated. If they aren't motivated, well, ...

Overall the science in ADV is to about helping to develop a Christian worldview in seeing God in science. As you study the names of Jesus in the Bible, you will learn some basics in science that match it. For example, as you learn that Jesus is the light on the world, you study stars and universe. As you study Jesus is the bread of life, you do a fun unit on learning how to bake bread and the effects of yeast and various yeast experiments. Also, there is a unit on birds of the Bible (a small break from names of Jesus) where you tie in the Birds of Bible and science of birds while also doing state birds as part of overview of the 50 states. and so on like that. So, now you're giving them a basis to see God when they study nature and other science.

It's very hands on and designed to help ages 8 and under to be curious about the world around them, to train them to observe, and to provide an introduction to the scientific method. Level of facts about the constitution and behavior of the physical world is kept at the concrete learning stage appropriate for the year.

science is scheduled 2-3 times per week, plus a nature walk. some weeks might be a little less. The week with the magnet kit is 4 times per week for 2 weeks. The Thanksgiving unit science is unit study based.
keeps with a "Charlotte Mason" influence in that you're doing 15-20 minutes.
lots of hands on experiments.
book basket again.
One of the main science spines, is an Usborne Internet Linked Encyclopedia -- so you can do more reading from the links, and more experiments from the links.

No -- it's not going to be super "in depth" detail because of the stage of learning of the child. The intent with Usborne style of books is to help generate interest in a topic, then you can read a little bit more if the child wants to. use the internet links from the book to add more...

But then again, if you want to study a topic in more detail, you will have the time to do that with your child. Part of the "Charlotte Mason" influence in MFW is having unstructured but productive afternoons. So, if you want to go more on a topic, or do extra topics, that can be done. I've like doing Janice van Cleave experiment books to add in a bit more. My library had them so it was check it out and then return it. very flexible. And kids like to repeat experiments. It's fun but as my dh says
Repeating experiments to check the results is another facet of scientific practice.
I like how a friend of mine whose kids are older and has homeschooled all along told me: I like what you do with your kids in MFW in science -- it's read just enough to spark their interest, do a hands on project to solidify it and then move on. They'll get more details in jr high and then high school.

Last edited by cbollin on Thu Oct 22, 2009 3:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Why not Apologia in elementary?

Unread post by TriciaMR » Fri Mar 11, 2011 8:17 pm

DaddyOfTwo wrote:We are finishing up our second year of MFW elementary, ready to begin ECC next year with our oldest. My wife and I were curious why MFW doesn't recommend using any Apologia science books until 7th grade. Apologia makes some excellent books about animals, botany, and astronomy which they tout as being their "elementary"-level books. Anyone know why, or have any thoughts one way or the other? I know the MFW-chosen science books for ECC are "Properties of Ecosystems" and "Living World Encyclopedia". Thanks for the help.
twas wrote:Wow, I was just getting on here to ask if anyone has subbed MFW in the elementary years with Apologia science. I thought I had settled on MFW starting with preschool in the fall, but now I'm looking around so that I can use Apologia the whole way through. Sorry, dont want to hijack your thread. Anxious to see the replies!
They use Apologia (Exploring Creation With Astronomy) in RTR and Exp to 1850 (Exploring Creation with Botany).

I've heard of other people using the some of the "Exploring Creation with ..." books in other years, but I find the science to be a good fit.

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Re: Why not Apologia in elementary?

Unread post by Julie in MN » Fri Mar 11, 2011 8:21 pm

MFW does, indeed, use two Apologia elementary books -
  • (1) Astronomy in RTR, which relates well to the historical time period, and
    (2) Botany in EX1850, when you spend a semester on animals and a semester on plants.
[woops - trish already said that!]

I know Apologia elementary has an animal series, but it is not an overview that can be done in a semester, since it takes three books to get through the animals, and those are typically done one per year -- so even though MFW uses its Apologia elementary books at a pace of one per semester, it would still take 3 semesters to cover animals. Apologia also just came out with a human body book, but it is some 250-plus pages and might be a little much for one semester at the 2nd-6th grade level.

A bit of MFW trivia: Marie Hazell selected Jeannie Fulbright's astronomy before it ever became an Apologia product, while it was still spiral bound! I think that's a good indication to how thoroughly she searches for the right materials.

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Re: Why not Apologia in elementary?

Unread post by 705emily » Fri Mar 11, 2011 9:11 pm


We have used MFW with the recommended science for all years (K, 1st, Adventures, and ECC). I found the MFW recommended science books went along very well with each year's curriculum.

This year--however while studying Creation to the Greeks--we decided to use the Fulbright, "Swimming Creatures" book. Our son is EXTREMELY interested in marine animals, and so this satisfied his interest. DD enjoys them too--but does not have the intense interest he does. All that to say--that you do have the freedom to use what you like.

In the elementary years--MFW selects science curriculum to support the themes being studied that year. The Fulbright books are very thorough and in-depth. On the other hand, MFW (in addition to their recommended spines) also suggests a lot of supplemental library books to be read on topics being studied. When those supplemental library books are utilized in conjunction with the spines, the science as recommended by MFW is very good!
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Re: Why not Apologia in elementary?

Unread post by gratitude » Fri Mar 11, 2011 11:39 pm

Our science has been a little mixed up with MFW due to what we had used when we arrived last March. So in answer to your question, yes, we have used Apologia elementary with MFW ADV (the answer to the second person's question).

With MFW 1 we had just finished the plants with SL, and I didn't want to do it again 2 months later. So last year we finished SL K with MFW 1. This past fall we did SL 1, while we finished MFW 1. Then we came to ADV, and we had already done Air & Kitchen. I was/am truly interested in the Apologia Elementary series, that did not [all] exist when MFW was assembled (the answer to the first question). So I asked Apologia, and they recommended starting with Astronomy. Now, this board highly recommends it not being used with children so young. I started last week though, after a lot of hesitation, and they loved it. So at the moment it is our science with ADV.

Now the problems with this of course is MFW does tie in this book later for R&R. This is somewhat problematic for the 'unit study' themes of MFW, and has thrown our studies off a little bit. I wouldn't say it has thrown it off a lot, but I can see that to truly use the program as written - with the work Marie put in - would be the highest if using the science recommended; especially for ECC. For us though we really love having God put into science. We both majored in science in college, so we are grateful when a book supports our faith.

I hope this doesn't confuse the issue, one way or the other. MFW science is more than strong enough for elementary.

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Re: Why not Apologia in elementary?

Unread post by baileymom » Sat Mar 12, 2011 8:37 am

I've always thought it was maybe due to the fact that Apologia Elementary is still developing...MFW has been around for a while now...and I appreciate the fact that there aren't constant changes/revisions.

We've used 2 Apologia Elementary books now (Astronomy and Flying Creatures), and although they're wonderful, I do find that we're reading, reading, reading, and narrating...and spending weeks and weeks and weeks on the same topic...not so bad with Literature/History...but the kids got kind of bored with that for Science.

I finally let go of what others 'say' about MFW's Science and just embraced it with ADV...and the kids are having a great time (finally) with Science and learning a lot!
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Question about Apologia elementary science?

Unread post by gratitude » Mon Oct 17, 2011 5:58 pm

luvmykidz wrote:I would love it if MFW would incorporate an Apologia option into the lesson plans. I am in love with both and am torn as to how to work it all out without burning us all out.
I wonder if you are meaning Apologia Elementary books? I have seen other moms, like myself, have a lot of interest in Apologia elementary books. As we all know Marie used the two that were available when she first put together MFW: Astronomy and Botany. Now though there are 4 more science books for elementary grades from Apologia. I know I am not the only one with elementary children who has showed interest in those books. I too would LOVE to see them incorporated into the 2nd - 6th grade programs.

Thank you MFW!
Last edited by gratitude on Tue Oct 18, 2011 9:55 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Question about Apologia elementary science?

Unread post by Julie in MN » Tue Oct 18, 2011 9:13 am

Well, like gratitude mentioned, if you use MFW as written, you will use two Apologia books over your years with MFW - Astronomy and Botany. Actually, Marie Hazell chose Exploring Creation with Astronomy before it was an Apologia product, and when it was spiral-bound, so there's a bit of history for you :o)

The other choices with Apologia would be (1) the three books on animals, and (2) the lengthy, 250-page book on the human body.

I think Marie decided that in both of those cases, a do-able one-semester study was preferable to spending many years on just studying animals and the human body. At least that's what I've heard over the years at conventions and such. And I wonder if some variety in science methods isn't desirable, too? I'm not sure I've read about the results of families doing every one of the 6 Apologia elementary books, and whether it stays exciting, appeals to all learners, adapts to families with different ages, etc.?

Anyways, we enjoyed the Apologia that we did but we also really liked the animal coverage in EX1850, using the Answers in Genesis book, and had fun with the human body study in RTR -- building the human body model, doing the fun Janice Van Cleave experiments, and reading together the important facts-o-life book. So that's just to encourage you that maybe having some variety over the years will be fun, if you need the lesson plans all planned out for you?

Or, if you want alternate lesson plans, I know Donna Young often shares Apologia lesson plans that she used or that others have shared with her:

But of course you could contact the office and share your ideas or see if they have considered any changes/alternate lesson plans for MFW? I'm sure others would like to hear what you find out!
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Re: Question about Apologia elementary science?

Unread post by gratitude » Tue Oct 18, 2011 10:06 am

Julie in MN wrote: So that's just to encourage you that maybe having some variety over the years will be fun, if you need the lesson plans all planned out for you?
Thank you Julie for answering a question I had yesterday after I posted. I wondered how those who had gone through the program and used both 2 Apologia Elementary books and Answers in Genesis & other programs I have not heard of felt & thought about their experience getting to do multiple science programs. I definitely need the lesson plans, and love the integration Marie does with the Bible, Christianity, and unit studies. My interest in Apologia did lead us to reading the Astronomy book for fun (I realize it will come in RTR, but exposure in my mind never hurts and I know they will still have plenty to learn from it when we reach RTR), and my oldest has enjoyed reading and quoting it a lot in the car.

As much as I have liked this book though for me I want an integrated curriculum so I am really looking forward to the science in ECC integrated with geography and a heart for the world and missions. A big part of me is looking forward to seeing what Answers in Genesis has done too! I have one friend who does her own curriculum who uses only Answers in Genesis, so I am curious. Anyways, you just inspired all those thoughts with your sharing that the variety was fun over the years. Thank you for sharing Julie. :-)


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Re: Question about Apologia elementary science?

Unread post by jasntas » Tue Oct 18, 2011 10:45 am

We are using Zoology 3 this year with CTG only because GFC did not appeal to me and my dc have a very high interest in animal science. They are loving it. It's one of their favorite parts of the day. BUT I completely intend on going back to MFW's recommendations for the rest of the cycle. Like Julie mentioned, I like the variety and I also like how it sometimes ties in with the rest of the program. (We did the 3 or so weeks of Pyramids when scheduled in the MFW TM.)

That being said, If you wanted to drop the recommended science and go strictly with Apologia, you could easily do that, IMO. There is a yahoo group (elem_apologia_science) that is a big help. In the files section, for instance, there are others who have posted their 1 year and 1/2 year schedules, quizes, and more. The author also frequently even answers questions herself.

I am scheduling the program myself. We are completing a lesson every two weeks. We read a little every day M-TH and on the second Thursday we do the experiment and take the quiz (from the above mentioned yahoo group). I purchased a lapbook program (the one by A Journey Through Learning purchased through currclick . com) and I schedule our reading around the lapbook pieces. The directions in the lapbook pieces tell what page the info is found on so we read up to that point and then do that piece for the day. Oh, and I also purchased a kit for the experiments because of the convenience and because the materials list is one major thing I miss from the MFW TM.

It has been easy for me to schedule and implement and we are enjoying it but I am also looking forward to going back to MFW's recommendations next year.

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Re: Question about Apologia elementary science?

Unread post by Cyndi (AZ) » Tue Oct 18, 2011 11:00 am

My dd is doing Apologia Anatomy in a co-op this year along with doing CTG as written at home. I'm thankful that Genesis for Kids is so fun and silly sometimes, because adding in all the homework she has from co-op hasn't seemed like Science overload to her at all.

But to me, it does a little - and I'm only involved in the homework, not the class. I think it depends on what you're willing to prepare and teach if you want to sub out or add anything. I'm spoiled. I let Marie do the homeschool planning and the coordinator do the co-op planning. I'm really interested to see how next year pans out if my dd is doing Apologia Anatomy now and will do Anatomy in RTR next year -- but then I'd be able to answer this question better!
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MFW Users/MFW Science Curiousity ?

Unread post by cbollin » Tue Oct 18, 2011 1:30 pm

gratitude wrote:This is a bit of a spin off of the other thread on Apologia Elementary Science.

Out of curiosity, for those of you who have used multiple MFW programs, what was your favorite year (or years) of MFW science?

For me my favorite science that I remember from MFW K, 1, & ADV would have to be the planet experiment that we did that was actually written by Marie in the MFW 1 manual. It was a lot of fun, and still remembered.

I am really interested though what those of you who have done part, or all, of the five year cycle have to say.
Would you like to hear the journey before my answer? (I should put this in the celebration thread. It almost belongs there.)

ECC science, first time I thought it was light. (What? it was my oldest child? gimme a break) Who does this thing called notebooking? Is that for real? What? And nature walks? What? Don’t they need more?. We need a real program. Then. By end of year “ooh, this is fun. We made a river. We learned about fat protecting in ice water. This is fun. Oh, lots of fun animals and plants. “ So we added an end of year field trip to a zoo and botanical garden. Then, my older real life friends told me that I had done a lot of good science. It wasn’t light after all according to the veterans back then.

CTG: first time.. this is the dumbest stupidest thing. My child is WAY above this nonsense. Ugh. I’ll have to add a real program I guess. So I added in a real program and nearly killed the love of science in my child. I remember my husband, who has a phd in chemistry, telling me “drop this stupid other program. Why can’t we just have some fun with the science and the nerd humor? What’s wrong with that? I don't like this other book you have.”

And we dropped that other creation based, thinking skills of science program.

RTR and 1st. Ok. This was fun! We really liked making our skeleton dudes. And the Astronomy was a big hit. We ended up asking for a telescope that year at Christmas from the rich grandparents. It’s hard for me to forgot the excitement that we all had that night on the driveway (back in Indiana of course) actually seeing the rings of Saturn through that telescope.

Yes, we did both RTR science and 1st science. I shuffled it all around and had exploration day on Friday. The girls just wanted to do both.

2006: EX1850. My girls had a lot of fun in the taxonomy of animal kingdom. Field trips were encouraged for nature walks, and we had a lot of fun with making some animal models with food. Ok, they liked it. Botany – not a big hit with us. I didn’t really like this book as much of other Jeannie Fulbright book (Astronomy). I was glad it was only for a semester. (preferences will vary!)

2007 1850MOD: oh yeah, that was the year that I thought was not enough, too much, but nothing and then…(lots of mixed feelings) Then, at the end of the year, I looked back and thought “wow… my kids really had fun with all of this.” It was the end of year co-op academic fair. We had no better term for that co-op end of year event. It was designed as non competitive. It was families brought out displays of stuff that was fun we did this year and shared with other families. My daughters had trouble trimming down which science projects were the most fun to show. I finally told them – we have room on the table for 5 things. They actually went back into their Usborne experiment book and re did lessons and experiments and set up the display. They took the Wired Kit and had fun. Everyone at the fair stopped by our booth and played with stuff.
I think MFW owes me a bar of chocolate for the free publicity I gave them that night. (wink wink giggle) Not only was our science display a hit, but we had another display next to it of all of our history fun. Oldest had the World Fair thing on display. She had her write from outline on display. We had stuff in Russian. And of course, the famous Russian manyiak recipe from MFW. all kinds of stuff. oh yeah, we took the states/capital game cards too. I remember that. and maps...

2008-09 back to ECC: oldest in apologia jr. high. She loved it. Middle gal in ECC. Ah, I really like this notebooking thing. (amazing how one’s point of view changes, huh).And we enjoyed all of the fun hands on stuff from the terrarium (that survived our out of state move), and the potato growing, and radish seeds, and make a river, and play with ice/snow. I know I am the total weirdo on the internet who actually likes the science in ECC. We ended up getting POE at very end of the year. and it was nice to read and by the end of ecc year (1st edition), we knew most of the info in the bigger fancier book.

2009-10: CTG: I took my husband’s advice and enjoyed the science nerd humor and we really enjoyed the experiments. Some weren’t perfect. Oldest was in apologia physical. hard year on me with moving out of state.

2010 RTR. middle gal once again enjoyed her skeleton, and she really enjoyed the astronomy too. She didn’t remember it all from when she was in 1st grade. But she really enjoyed the discovery and all of it. Pretty notebook.

This year: well, EX1850. middle gal is in General science. Youngest does some hodge podge from science in ADV and EX1850. It’s hard to teach my youngest with autism. She really enjoyed the sink float egg experiment in ADV. I loved watching her repeat it and try to duplicate it. Lots of learning.

And so it continues.

I’m sorry Carin, I don’t have a favorite. I took you through all of that to explain my answer. Each year, because it is unique, has been a delight all its own. I have been very thankful to Marie for having more than one author or publisher for science in elementary. It’s opened my children’s eyes to having fun in science. And I think both were ready for General in 7th. Even my slow middle gal is really getting it.


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Re: MFW Users/MFW Science Curiousity ?

Unread post by gratitude » Tue Oct 18, 2011 3:17 pm

cbollin wrote:Would you like to hear the journey before my answer?
8[] 8[] ;( 8[] ;( Your answer made me laugh & cry. Your answer really touched me Crystal. In some places it made me laugh, and in others it was so beautiful.

I have read so many moms at my place of the journey interested in so many things. In many ways we just have too much curriculum at our finger tips, which is why early on I knew I had to choose one and stay there. When I listen clearly to God he always leads me to the same place for our family for home schooling: MFW. I like hearing from Julie on the other thread, and from you on this one, that for both of you a variety of science in the elementary years really worked well. The 'been there, done that' is always very valuable to read. Your quote at the end though does give an answer that is interesting: It prepared them for Apologia Junior High science and let them have a positive fun experience with science along the way.

I Love reading the experiences of those who have gone before me.

Julie in MN
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Joined: Mon Jun 28, 2004 3:44 pm
Location: Minnesota


Unread post by Julie in MN » Sat Mar 30, 2013 5:20 pm

hollydolly wrote:Why does MFW only use a couple of the Elementary Apologia books? Is there something they didn't like about the ones not selected? Why did they choose the random science books through the years over Apologia? Was it to match the topic better? For example, I saw that in one of the years anatomy is taught but Apologia is not used...
Well, first of all, I like this bit of trivia:
MFW used Jeannie Fulbright's Astronomy before it was an Apologia product.
To me, that shows Marie Hazell's researching skills to locate the best products for us.

Then, about the Apologia elementary books other than the ones MFW uses (astronomy and botany), they fall into 2 groups:

1. Animals - MFW covers this in one semester using an AIG text (which Marie also chose before it was an AIG text, by the way). Apologia would require at least 3 books to cover all animals, I believe.

2. Anatomy - MFW covers this in one semester using a lot of hands-on and a facts-of-life book, while Apologia would require using a 300+ page book for grades 2-6. Plus it would still have to be done in a semester if MFW were to keep all of the other science topics in place. Covering more science topics might be part of it, too.

There are a few more thoughts here:
Julie, married 29 yrs, finding our way without Shane
Reid (21) college student; used MFW 3rd-12th grades (2004-2014)
Alexandra (29) mother; hs from 10th grade (2002)
Travis (32) engineer; never hs

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Re: Apologia

Unread post by MelissaB » Sat Mar 30, 2013 5:32 pm

Ah.. that's good to know. I had wondered that, too. :-)
Melissa B. (Arkansas)
Girls ages 16 & 13
Completed K, 1st, and Investigate {ECC; CTG; RTR; Expl.-1850; and 1850-Mod. Times}
"That they may teach the young women to be sober, to love their husbands, to love their children,.." Titus 2:4

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Re: Apologia

Unread post by clarinetlaj » Thu Apr 18, 2013 10:00 pm

super helpful! I was thinking of tacking on apologia, but now im re-thinking

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