Academics - Have MFW students gone on to college?

[Julie in MN]

Two questions my husband already thought of, and thought you all might know:
I think this was already mentioned on a post I read but don't remember where - are MFW high school courses geared for the college-bound?
and
Have any of the author's children used these programs and gone on to college? I hope this doesn't sound like a silly question, but in the past some of the publishers' materials I've chosen were really neat from a Charlotte Mason perspective, but it did not appear that any of the publishers' children had gone on to college (usually they were helping in the family business, etc.) and as neat as some of the things were that I used, I wonder if my children have had enough meat for what will be expected of them on college entrance exams, etc. (How was that for a run-on sentence!?) :)

Sometimes I feel like we are under a homeschooling microscope because my husband works for a University and we become the poster children for homeschooling. Only problem is, we are answering to God, not to what the academic community expects!
-LA in Baltimore-

The Hazells still have 3 at home, but I believe 2 of their older kids are in a competitive engineering college. I think Marie was referring to those 2 boys using MFW in this thread: http://board.mfwbooks.com/viewtopic.php ... 1673#p1673 Although of course the high school program wasn't written yet and they were probably the earliest pilot kids for that.

Both parents have college degrees, as well. The author's degree relates to teaching and curriculum writing. Another "qualification" your husband might be interested in is the fact that the Hazells spent 8 years as missionaries in the Russia area, and David Hazell still serves Bible translation groups in that area of the world.

I, myself, have a son who graduated from a competitive engineering school. Although he was not homeschooled, I can say that I am aware of what's ahead and am still completely confident in the education my youngest is receiving through MFW.

I think dh can rest easy :o)

[HSmommi2mine]

Yes, the author has children in college and while they may not have used the exact things they really were the original ginny pigs before the programs were even formally written.

[cbollin]

LA,
I don’t think your husband's questions sound silly at all. Sounds like your dh is putting some thought into it. Good for him!!!

MFW’s high school programs are designed for college prep path. They are not college level, but college prep high school level. The high school program is done more independently, the lesson plans are written to the student. There is a weekly meeting with parents to stay on track. And MFW seems to be recommending a path that should meet or exceed many college entrance requirements in terms of science and math, and having appropriate level English. Lots of essay writing. And MFW recommends doing foreign language. So, they are definitely designing a high school program with the goal in mind of helping your child not just get into college, but be ready to do well. It is more of the classical side of MFW’s programs.

Additionally, MFW recommends parents read up on ways to earn dual enrollment credit, and other college admission issues. They sell a book on the high school page called College Without Compromise. So, I think MFW is serious about helping us help our children go the college route.
(my quick review of that book -- some parts are written in mind to readers who are much more conservative than I am, but I still liked reading the book and took with a grain of salt the little unimportant things in that book that didn't matter. But I say that b/c it is worth noting in my opinion. It's a good book to read before hitting too far along in high school years so that you can be thinking ahead for college.)


I think that kids who aren’t college bound will still benefit from the structure and independent learning in MFW high school.

The high school program is different from the other programs in amount of day and all of that. You’re using ADV which was designed for children in grades 2 or 3. I realize that you’re using it with older children. But if your husband is concerned that all of the MFW programs are at that level then let him know that is not the case. MFW doesn’t stay at the same at the different stages of learning.

Marie Hazell holds a masters degree. David, her husband, has a college degree too. And as Julie mentioned, writing curriculum isn’t the only thing they’ve done. They were missionaries and Bible translators. That takes some education right there.

but I believe 2 of their older kids are in a competitive engineering college.

Continuing with Julie’s assurances to your husband’s good questions:
Oldest Hazell son is holding a very high GPA in his junior or senior year at a competitive engineering school in the Midwest. Also has an internship/co-op at a firm that is *not* his family's business, and still is a volunteer firefighter too. I forget how high his ACT scores were, but there were above the average for that school.

Next "child" is at a different university double majoring in whatever they are (but not engineering). He earned some college credits while in high school. I enjoy this young man's advice about doing homework in college and staying on track each week and not cramming for finals. Not sure his GPA, but I’m sure it is up there. Very smart and motivated!!!

In addition to the research into quality academic materials, the Hazells also use the real life college experiences of their sons as one more factor in writing a college prep high school program. Working hard each day and keeping up with a syllabus is part of the program <grin>> So, that kind of thing is built into MFW 's high school program. !!!!

And as Julie said, the author still has 3 children at home. Looking forward to hearing how the next one does next year as well as another staff child who graduates this year as they will have done the hs- program in various pilot stages. (Thinking to myself????When did they get that old? I've been a customer for a long time!!!)

There are other pilot families using the high school program who are not children of the author or staff kids. The programs are at various piloting stages.


One thing to keep in the back of your mind... depending on locations and schedules, you can preview the high school program materials at a convention.
-crystal

[LA in Baltimore]

As far as the High School Level looking CM:
Compared to some of the "traditional" high school publishers we have used with our oldest,
MFW does seem to be more CM in style.
For example, there aren't tests in EVERY subject.
Essays and Timelines have a happy place in the curriculum. :)
SIDE NOTE: It is good that some subjects have tests, etc. because as they move on to college, many of their larger, lower-level classes will have tests, but it doesn't seem like you'd need to have them in every subject. I'm VERY OPEN to other opinions on this! :)

Hope you are all enjoying this holiday weekend,
LA in Baltimore

[Lisa M]

Just thought I would share for anybody considering MFW for the first year of High School. My daughter is the least "academic" of my three children. She struggles a bit with understanding math, but is an avid reader and good writer. She was also my least motivated worker, procrastinating work whenever possible. Before this year, we had done almost no formal grammar, and no structured essay/paper writing. She is now 18 weeks into Year 1.

We just had her do some academic testing (because we have access to a trustworthy colleague who offered) just to see where we were and if there were any "holes" in her thinking ability. She scored at or above 12th grade level in every ability area! She was told she could do anything she chose to do. This is from a 15 year old kid who doesn't think she is smart.

Just the the bit we have done with MFW this year has just served to fill in a few areas that we hadn't taught yet, and we've only just begun. This really has been a fantastic program, efficient and focused on the important areas. Now that she can see her entire year planned out, she absolutely hates to get behind and will diligently work on the weekends if she was unable to complete the week's work. I am so pleased with the quality and quantity of her daily work load. She is enjoying it, too. My husband and I are both college grads (he almost has a doctorate) and we know what college prep means. I wish I could have done such interesting and relevant work when I was in high school. Maybe I would have remembered more!

In addition to MFW, we use Daily Grams 9 by Easy Grammar, Word Roots B2 by Critical Thinking Company, ALEKS online Algebra 1, Apologia Biology, and Rosetta Stone Spanish. She is taking piano lessons and plays high school sports as well.

[4Truth]

Now that she can see her entire year planned out, she absolutely hates to get behind and will diligently work on the weekends if she was unable to complete the week's work. I am so pleased with the quality and quantity of her daily work load.

Yes!!! My dd is only on week 2 of AHL, and I'm already seeing the same results. She just started high school level work in January and I was going to try to save money and a host of other reasons for pulling together my own eclectic mix. Well, it didn't take long for us to see that that just wasn't going to work, so I broke down and bought AHL a couple of weeks ago. We (dh, dd, and I) are SO glad I did for all the same reasons you listed. We're only on week 2, but the difference between AHL and what we were doing is like night and day!

[Lisa M]

I wanted to take a minute and share my observations about the entire MFW curriculum, because so many of you have been faithful to share your insights with me over the years.

I have a 17 year old daughter, who is now a "Junior" by school standards. She has never been my academic one - easily distracted, gets behind if I'm not watching her every minute, struggles with technical/logical detail work (math and science). We started using MFW when she was in 7th grade so didn't get the full benefit. However, she did use High School Year 1 and Year 2. She has now started Running Start (which means she can take community college classes as a high schooler and receive dual credit). Setting aside the whole discussion about whether or not this is a good idea for a Christian home schooler...I just want to comment about how she is doing.

After her 3rd week taking sign language, English 101, and Sociology, she is still holding A's and high B's in everything, INCLUDING the argumentative structured paper she had to write in the first week. She is taking all of her classes online, and spends about 3 hours a day at the most. The most time we've spent beyond that was trying to figure out how to upload a video to her professor's email. She admits that home schooling with MFW was way more intensive than her first quarter of college. Now, if she had started with Biology, US History, and Pre-Calculus, or was attending an elite private college, her day would definitely be heavier and she might not be doing as well. But the point here is to say that, after only 2 years of MFW high school, is VERY prepared for typical first quarter state college coursework.

And we still add MFW Bible, and will supplement her summers with Year 3 and 4 MFW history/government/economics reading.

Thank you MFW.

[cbollin]

Not that it really matters to me right now but was just wondering and someone asked this about this curriculum. . . . Does anyone know what the SAT or ACT scores have been from dc that have been thru the whole MFW program?? How as a whole group have they measured up to the general population that takes the tests? I think I have seen the results or something somewhere but have forgotten what they were. Sorry I know that this really should not matter but we all know of "public school" minded people out there and sometimes it is good to have solid numbers behind all the other good reasons for homeschooling!!!

Thanks for any info given!
~Stacey

I have some not so random thoughts, but I'll wait on that....

very quick answer.. .this is copy and paste from the FAQ on mfw's website

How does My Father's World curriculum meet state standards and perform on standardized test?
We consistently hear good reports from our customers about their children's scores on standardized achievement tests. Our programs cover all the required learning goals and standard requirements of most departments of education for grades K-12, though from a Christian perspective. The programs are written by a certified teacher and cover all subjects needed for a strong academic, as well as Biblical, foundation. We may teach topics in a different order than a specific state, but everything is covered. Therefore when MFW students are tested on material already covered in our programs they score well. Those of us who have used MFW for many years have learned not to worry when a state test covers material not yet covered in MFW curriculum. We know that this material will be covered at a later time and then be reflected in test scores.

All the feedback we have received from high school students using MFW is that they are testing above average on the SAT and ACT tests. MFW graduates are reported to have gone on to receive merit-based scholarships for universities.

While we are happy to share about academic achievements of those who have graduated with MFW, we are more pleased that these young men and women have received unparalleled Bible and character training. MFW is one of the only curricula available that has students complete a sweeping overview of Scripture-from Genesis to Revelation-three times before graduation. The third time through, our high school students are responsible for reading, in a responsive way, every verse of the Old Testament (9th grade) and the New Testament (10th grade). This expectation, coupled with being taught Biblical worldview, complete church history, and apologetics, prepares young adults to be launched in effective service in the Kingdom of God. For these reasons, in addition to a strong standard of academics, we believe MFW stands out when compared to other curriculum choices.

[Julie in MN]

Since you aren't getting many responses (probably because not many have gotten here yet and are online), I can give my little survey of 3 children raised in my home, one of whom has done MFW for a long time.

(1) Youngest -- has done MFW from 3rd to 10th so far. He has had to test every year in MN, although he is my least likely kid to care about testing. He does have college ability, I think, but folks on this message board know that I coddled him in terms of not making him use a pencil too much (he types his work now) and reading aloud to him into the upper grades. He taught himself to read before kindergarten but has never liked to read. Humans are so complex! I think this kid just read because he wanted to be a part of the adult world?

Anyways, this student used MFW and did well on the Iowa Basics test from 3rd to 8th, often getting "post high school" scores, with maybe one or two areas that were more average (or often he just needed a particular testing skill). His last Iowa Basics in 8th showed "Grade Equivalent" scores of 9th grade at the lowest and many said 13+.

Last year, he took the PLAN test, which is the pre-ACT. This year he took the PSAT, but as Crystal mentioned the scores aren't back yet. These tests are no longer compared with all students (public schools use other tests for that). Only the students who want to take this test (usually because they are looking at college) will be compared on these kinds of tests. The PLAN score card has lots of numbers, but in essence he got:

• 20 out of 32 total
  "At" college readiness in reading (I told you he doesn't like to read!)
  "Above" readiness in English, math, and science

And again, this is my kid who just doesn't push himself very much, so I am pleased with the MFW results.

This is where I hope Julie might tell her story about how her oldest son used "inferior" curriculum and still did well in college. It might help with the perspectives and fears many homeschoolers have that somehow they have to pick the perfect curriculum.

(2) Oldest -- yes, public schooled. We live in a pretty inferior school district, a shrinking tiny first-ring suburb that accepts expelled kids from Minneapolis. My oldest was a little bit sheltered by being in the "challenge" classes through elementary and middle school and making friends with those kids, but he was rarely challenged -- still being taught the difference between too, to, and two in high school. He didn't take any advanced science past the usual 3 high school sciences. He also missed out on a whole year of high school geometry because he was pulled out for Algebra I & II at the college when in 8th grade, and when he decided to come back to ps math in 9th, they only had a sort of "geometry for failing kids" which was coloring shapes when he tried it, and otherwise said they combined geometry with other things.

In the end, he was accepted to all colleges he applied for, graduated from the Colorado School of Mines with honors as a petroleum engineer, and was offered several jobs. I think the lesson there is that curriculum is not the most essential thing. But you do have to have some things that stands out. My oldest was a good test taker, he wrote an enthusiastic essay (and accepted writing criticism from mom over the years), and he had some college math programs during high school that stood out (alongside some really lame math on his transcript).

(3) Middle - might as well throw in my 3rd child, just to show the full range, and reinforce again that it's more than curriculum. She was doing fine in public school until she wasn't able to transition to high school, so when she failed 9th grade, I brought her home. We battled it out for at least 4 years at home, I still haven't given her a diploma at age 24, and she may never go to college. However, the best thing I did for her in high school was to try to work alongside her and teach her how to learn as best I could, and most of all I had her go through the entire Bible. My dd has her issues, but when I look at most of her friends who did go on to battle it out at colleges of one sort or another, I do think she is one of the more stable in her worldview. If MFW had been available for her at the time, I think there would have been some more benefits in terms of teaching her responsibility, and getting in that Bible and worldview without so much of my time being spent planning (and I would have been calmer when she didn't cooperate, because I wouldn't have invested so much of myself in every detail).



Well, sorry so long, but there's my little 3-kid survey
Julie

[asheslawson]

We have successfully used MFW since my oldest sons mid-K year. He will be going into 3rd next year. I am thinking more and more about the 'long-haul' of home schooling. I am struggling some with the thoughts of 'home schooling' versus the 'text book' method I experienced as a student. I know from actual students that A Beka students (both home schooled and in private school) do well on pre-college tests and in college academically. I will admit the text book method sounds easier at this point; the comfort of knowing the potential academic out-come.

Up to this point MFW has been our choice purely for spiritual reasons. It needs to become my choice now for both spiritual and academic reasons, in order to continue onto ECC next year. Our personal goal for our children is the hope that they would choose to pursue God's call in their lives, which may or may not include college. I do though want to keep doors open for them with my curriculum choices; if they should so choose to go to college, and God opens a door for them to do so, I would not want the door closed because I didn't prepare them adequately for that step.

I realize MFW has only been around for 12 years, and they just finished the high school program, so this question may not be answerable; but has any student that has used MFW curriculum successfully graduated, tested, and gone onto college.

Thank you!

This probably won't answer your question..I haven't been home schooling for a very long time..however I have a thought. I am beginning to believe that life really is the greatest preparation for college and academics are very important, but not everything. I think my children that are being home schooled may be far more prepared for college, and I think this because of my older children who were not home schooled. My younger children are learning to pace themselves, and to be a bit more self sufficient during their work. I work closely with them often, but I also try to allow them to self-direct a little in some areas. I give them a start and see what they can come up with before I jump in with direction on some things.

I also think the spiritual side of MFW may be the single most important thing we can do to prepare our children for college. I am seeing my children grow and learn more in their relationships with Christ because it is continually a part of their lives, at church, home, extracurricular activities, etc. History has seemed more cohesive to my son now that he is able to learn more of the how and why - whereas in public school they simply stated an event occurred and gave a date because going into the details of the reason for the event would have involved too much detail about religion. Because of this the information was dry and stale and not easily remembered.

One strong reason is because of how poor the high school education turned out to be for one of my oldest children, who just graduated in the top 10 students of his senior class last year, but was completely un-prepared for college. He had teachers who literally were not teaching. They spent class time building human pyramids or just giving busy work. This was most shocking when it came to his teacher in upper level math classes. He had some good teachers, no doubt, but the teachers who did not try to teach were a very big problem to him, not only because he was not learning, but because he was learning so much about a huge deficiency in professionalism in our schools. This has given him a rather tainted impression of college educated individuals and I have watched him struggle to keep up in college.

I sure don't know if this helps...but it is just some of the reasons I feel like my children may actually have better opportunities for education past high school.

[Julie in MN]

I like that answer. Life really is complex and the curriculum is probably not the most important piece.

Anyways, Carin, there probably are not folks on this board that will fit your qualifications. Since US2 only came out last year, the only folks who would meet your qualifications are folks who used US2 last year (plus using MFW for the previous 6 years of course), or pilot families. And I can assure you that there are few of those families who frequent this board, because I've been on this board for 8 years and all the oldies-but-goodie-boardies like me have kids my son's age (16) or younger -- crystal, Susan on the Space Coast, etc. I'm sure many of us would be glad to chat about academics, but we don't have MFW graduates yet.

Try the office -- Lucy's oldest must be graduating this year? And the Hazells of course. And they of course know all the pilot families (although the programs they used might not be exactly the same).

You might also peruse the High School archives for various related topics.

Best wishes as you worry over your little ones,
Julie

[gratitude]

this is on mfw's website

• All the feedback we have received from high school students using MFW is that they are testing above average on the SAT and ACT tests. MFW graduates are reported to have gone on to receive merit-based scholarships for universities.

the problem is? those graduates aren't cyber talkers. unlike us.. they have lives

When my oldest was 8, I wasn't worried on this stuff.
-crystal

O.K., O.K., Cyrstal & Julie, you both have a scripture coming to mind. And Jesus said, "Do not worry about tomorrow, for today has enough worries of its own." Matthew ?:?

Thank you for your patience with me, your thorough answers, and the time that you took that actually gave me a lot of insights into MFW's high school program that doesn't come through a catalogue or web-site. It also gave me a lot of insight into the 'successes' of MFW. I probably shouldn't have put the 7 years. Your experience does count Crystal. As well as your reminder that their success depends on many many factors: life experiences, me as a teacher, their own God given talents and abilities, what I do as a teacher - or don't do, and then the curriculum adds some to the whole picture. You both also made a very good point about the fact that college preparation isn't just about academics. I agree. Study skills, self motivation, discipline, spiritual walk, and good choice making are all part of it. The last one is probably in many ways the most important, if college is still like it was when I went.

So why am I worrying? Our kids were sick the past 10 days and I have been averaging 4 - 6 hours of sleep at night; a lack of sleep always sends my thinking a bit hay-wire. They are better now. I just need a good nights sleep tonight.

We haven't had the greatest home schooling year, but at the same time some good things have happened. My oldest is easy to home school at this point, which is a blessing. I think though with MFW I need to do more as a teacher. It isn't easy for me to implement at all. Text books would be easy; but that isn't really the kind of education I have wanted for my children. So I need to step up and do more, and I do realize that fact. Realizing it is one thing though, and next year I really do need to put it into action.

Well... thanks for the reminder not to worry. It is all in the Hands of Jesus, as long as I remember to keep it there. He has a plan for their life, as long as I can stay out of the way. They are both showing some wonderful goals to work for God's Kingdom, and it amazes me because it is so different from anything I ever would have thought of at their ages. I hear my youngest waking up. Thank you for your kind words ladies. This board really has kept me home schooling the past 12 months and I am grateful.

[Amy C.]

Carin,

I do not have any BTDT experience. My oldest is finishing up 7th grade, will be 8th grade next year, and I have been looking into college requirements and looking ahead to the MFW high school years.

I have had a similar question but from a different angle. Does MFW prepare the high school grad to have a strong Biblical worldview to stand firm in his/her faith and be able to defend it, in college and throughout life? I have been made aware of a particular professor at my small town's community college in the deep Bible-belt South who is causing his students to question the existence of God. I have heard that he is having his students raise their hands if they believe in God and then tells them to prove it without using the Bible and then ridicules them for their belief. Yes, his class is required for all students. I have heard of this happening in other areas, but not here, not until now. It is making me realize how more and more important it is to help our children solidify their faith and help them as they "own" it for themselves and know what they believe and why they believe it. Yes, I am concerned about academics and academic prep for college, but more than that I am concerned that they are not swayed in their faith in God and have a strong anchor there. The mother who first talked to me about this particular professor I mentioned is a homeschooling mother who has graduated 2 of her 4 children using Abeka. They are VERY active in a very large (and some see as very successful) church. They have been members and deeply involved there all their lives. Telling you this to say that this family would be looked upon as a very solid Christian family who has done everything "right", even homeschooling their kids and using the most popular hs curriculum in our area - Abeka. However, their oldest son (who had this professor in jr/community college) is now at a 4 year college and is questioning whether there is even a God. As I said, many people in my area use Abeka. I even overheard this same family's children's minister's wife say that they are using Abeka because it teaches how to write a research paper. I say this respectfully, but what does it prosper our children if they know how to write a research paper but lose their belief in God. In other words, "What does it prosper a man if he gains the whole world but loses his soul". Don't get me wrong. I want my children to be able to write a research paper (which MFW does cover) and be prepared for college, but even more so I want them to have a strong faith that is not tossed to and fro or even destroyed by those who would seek to do that.

I am certainly not dismissing your question. I am not trying to criticize Abeka. I guess you could "add" to it whatever else you felt your child needed, like a worldview course/book, but from what I hear, it is a very full and stringent curriculum as written that leaves very little time for much else, if you do it in it's entirety. I am learning the beauty of MFW and how it combines academics and a Biblical worldview that is woven throughout the academics. And it leaves some room/time to actually learn how to live it out. I think we all need to be looking ahead to our children's futures and doing our best to prepare them. This homeschooling journey can be a heavy one, but recently God has been dealing with me about how His yoke is easy and His burden is light. He wants me to come to Him and rest in Him. I know that He led us to MFW. I didn't realize all the implications and reasons for that at the time, but am beginning to see it more and more clearly now. The more I look at MFW's heart and goals, the more I am convinced it is the right path for us. And I have been pleased with the academic aspect of it as well.

I know also that I cannot put my hope and trust in a specific curriculum. I must put my hope and trust in God and believe that He will accomplish His good purpose in my children's lives. But that is also why I think it is so important to stay close to Him and seek Him on all of life's decisions, including which curriculum to use in our hs'ing. Praying for you in your decisions as you seek God's direction for you and your children.

Not from a family of MFW graduates. We have not even gotten to high school yet, but wanted to share my thoughts because truly all of this has been heavy on my heart and mind lately.

Amy C.

P.S. Maybe should start another thread, but would love to hear any testimonies about how God has prepared your high school/college child to be strong in his/her faith and belief in God.

[cbollin]

in general terms of what I have seen in MFW high school:
1. lots of essays and lit analysis require the student to take a position and explain it.
2. I like to challenge my daughter and usually ask her well... what do you think about this opposite side of it? then we talk it out.

I've told her over and over... you can't expect that everyone is going to agree with you. With they don't, you need to be a bit more like your dad and not care what others think on it.

part of things in college life for me in a secular university?
*being part of a campus christian fellowship. prayer warriors, and living in strong community and talking about this stuff.
*just knowing that others didn't think like me.. well you see.... when I was in high school I didn't believe, so I know..... that side of it....
*just knowing that it wasn't my job to convert anyone took the pressure off of me. I might be the only Bible they read was a popular saying back then like it is now.
*I was willing to tell professors, I dont' know. I don't have all answers for everything.. I like to learn though.
*prayer support daily from the church I attended... they wanted to impact campus....

I haven't used the speech/communication credit yet to know how that will work into the stuff that Amy is asking.

I think this post by someone else, should help about college prep and strong academics... Carin, enjoy this link
http://board.mfwbooks.com/viewtopic.php ... 126#p81126

[Amy C.]

I did talk to our youth minister (who also holds a position at this same college in the BSU) to see if he knew this particular prof and if he knew anything about what I had heard from this mother. Yes, he did and yes, he had, from students who had taken this course. He said that our youth need to be able to defend/prove the existence of God and the truths of the Bible through other avenues besides just the Bible (history, archeology, etc.).

He did use this quote, "Can you prove to me, sir, that George Washington existed....without using history books."

He said that our youth need to learn how to respectfully engage the opposition....to be prepared to give an answer to their faith in a way that is respectful and true and not be bullied by others. He said sometimes professors like that need to be given a "push" back (again respectfully but firmly). I just want my boys to be well prepared for this sort of thing, not a "hit you over the head" with it but able to give "an answer to their faith in season and out of season".

Amy C.

[dhudson]

My oldest is just finishing his first year in MFW high school and I can say that I am more than pleased at what he has learned. I am one who constantly is checking to see if we are academically rigorous enough and I would confidently say that MFW is college prep. I spent A LOT of time critiquing high school programs and we chose MFW because of these things:

1. We loved that our kids would read the entire Bible and we were really happy with the worldview and practical applications of their faith in years 3 & 4.

2. MFW gives a through grounding in history and English while not being too overwhelming so that our kids can also follow their passions. For instance, our ds has had time to follow his love of math, science and programming and because of that has an unpaid internship this summer with some programmers at my dh's workplace. He also has had time for piano, Bible Bowl and karate, all of which are great and are valuable to having a well rounded student.

3. For us, it follows a classical structure and is firmly in the rhetoric stage. We also love how MFW integrates History, Bible, and English which helps our ds make connections. The papers on Greek gods vs the One True God or Who is the True Hero: Hector or Achilles? Come to mind. He is taking what he has learned of the Bible and of literature and history and making his own opinions and theories and communicating them. That is a very college prep skill.

4. I have called and spoken to College Registrars and have asked what colleges want to see in a homeschool graduate and MFW fulfills much of that.

I don't know yet how they will do in college but I can see how a great foundation is being laid. I would write out your goals for your homeschool graduate. What is most important to you and then start looking at what can fulfill those goals. Asking questions is a good thing. I ask a lot of questions so that I can give my dh the best info so that we can make an informed decision. I think you got a lot of great advice from pp and I know I have asked many of the pilot families (some who are MFW staff and some who are like me and work in convention season) how MFW worked for their college graduates and it has given me great peace.


P.S. I hope you get some sleep soon.

[ilovemy4kids]

Hello and welcome! When we began with MFW, I too was worried about college prep. In fact, I posted on many, many forums, took some flack from a dear friend who said from looking at the catalog, MFW was too "light". Well, we chose to go with it and 4 years later are very happy. Our son has thrived academically with MFW. The only drawback we've had is he missed doing school with his sister and vice versa. But, that's our own family issue which we have resolved. I love the flexibility of homeschooling.

MFW has done an amazing job preparing our son for college thus far. His standardized testing scores are amazing. More importantly, however, is his UNDERSTANDING and RETENTION of what he has learned. He consistently engages in conversation with adults from all walks of life, college professors included, and they always remark on his amazing understanding of History and how it relates to today. His writing skills have improved dramatically. His study skills are being developed. I look back and am so happy that we made the decision to use MFW for high school. We did ECC in grade school, part of Exploration to 1850, left MFW then came back to it for High School.

A friend of ours made the choice at the same time to leave MFW and go with Abeka online for high school. She is now considering coming back to MFW for the last two years of the oldest and the rest for the younger ones. Reason - the joy of learning has been squashed a bit, the knowledge is there for the tests, but the big connections are seeming to be missing. Those are her thoughts.

Anyway, ds 15 will take the ACT in June and we will see how that goes for a trial run. His PLAN, PSAT, and Standfords were all great. I couldn't be happier. Our children begged to do MFW together again, dd was supposed to start Ancients this year, but truly desires to do "school" with her brother again. So we are. Not a usual situation and I made a few posts about it. Even though we will modify a few things for her, and offered to change curriculum so they could work together with something easier, they both answered with a resounding NO. MFW is superior, at least according to my kiddos. A brain workout that makes you think, is a description they have used. It's not just memorize for the test.

Blessings
Sandra

[lea_lpz]

Looking at the hs suggested course of study the requirements would far above exceed the UC and CSU requirements as well as most private schools in my state. I have worked at the Transfer Center at UC Berkeley and a re-entry center at a community college and am in an educational counseling master's program and so am familiar with entrance requirements for freshmen admits. Of course not all students who are homeschooled will be able to follow the exact suggestions, but generally you need 2 years foreign language, 4 years college prep level English, 3 years math (alg, geo, alg. 2/ trig), 2 years science, and 3 years history. If your child struggles in Math they can take algebra spread over 2 years and still get credit.

On a personal note, I believe the most successful freshmen are those who have the ability to critically think, are independent workers, and organized. It's far more important your child knows how to learn than has been able to robotically memorize a ton of material. Maturity is so important. I can't tell you how many young kids I have met at community college who are pressured by family to take classes and are failing courses because they just do not have the maturity yet, especially young men! Those grades will stay on their record, even if they drop out and come back to school 5 years or so later and get all a's & b's; when they apply to transfer the past grades will be factored in.

A little off topic but I really encourage parents to not force / push students who are not ready to go to college. If they can do something else productive like apprentice in a skilled trade, work, join military, travel or just actively help in the home and enter school when ready, between 23 and around 26, I have seen them do so much better, especially men! I feel like we put a lot of pressure on kids today and for them to feel like at 18 they have to choose a career for the rest of their life is a hi responsibility; now of course, that is not the reality, unless your field is very specialized, like a doctor or engineer, that is not true, and I spend a lot of time explaining that to students, but that's how most 18 and 19 year olds feel. My husband and I are friends with a couple where the wife just graduated from Berkeley and will be starting grad school in the fall and her husband got accepted to UC Berkeley as a transfer student! My friend left after her first semester at UCB to marry her college sweet heart who had joined the military. Two years later they had a son. When his contract was up they decided to move back to Berkeley so my friend could return to school. They had to sell their home and relocate from Arizona. Her husband got a job for the UCPD and when I met him he said school was never his thing and he wanted to be an officer. Well two years later, at 26, he decided to use his GI Bill and give it a try, after being inspired by his wife! He graduated from community college with honors and this guy said he'd never go to college and hated school growing up. Incredible!

[cbollin]

4. I have called and spoken to College Registrars and have asked what colleges want to see in a homeschool graduate and MFW fulfills much of that.

I just wanted to say that perhaps checking with Admissions Officers is a better starting place on most colleges. Then, in a few cases, it could be a Registrar's office. but start with the Admissions Offices.
most registrars offices work with enrolled students.... it might vary...

If they can do something else productive like apprentice in a skilled trade, work, join military, travel or just actively help in the home and enter school when ready, between 23 and around 26, I have seen them do so much better, especially men!

that was the case with one of my favorite students in the physics dept where I worked. Jeff wasn't ready right out of high school. Got a job in sales at department store, then when he was 21 he was ready for college. Top notch student! and transferred in our 3-2 program to the state university with engineering department...

gap year is definitely becoming more the norm.

HSLDA has lots of info on their site about "after high school

take a look....

http://www.hslda.org/highschool/after.asp

[gratitude]

I thought I would come back onto this thread because I had something happen this week that may have helped with this question.

A very wonderful MFW mom PM'ed me with a suggestion that has proven to be very helpful (Thank you Donna!). The suggestion was to print out all of the samples from the MFW programs and lay them out side by side to see the big picture that unfolds across the entire program. I printed out the samples this morning and have so far gone through all of the grids; I still want to go through all of the notes. A few things stood out as I went through one grid and then another from ECC through high school, and it did leave me with two questions that go along with this thread.

1. Doesn't MFW more than adequately prepare students for college? As I went through 'how' the various books are used & writing is assigned on the grids it just seemed to me like plenty of work was being done from my memory of school. I was even in a gifted program, and I don't remember doing nearly so much for my school studies.

2. Does MFW teach kids to 'think' as much as it might appear looking at the different skills being developed? I have been thinking this winter about teaching children to 'think' versus rote answers to questions. So as I was looking at all the materials and light bulbs were going off in my head of ahh...I am starting to see a real picture of MFW...it started to dawn on me that their goal of raising 'thinkers', as David says on one of the CDs, looked like it was very possibly throughout the program in a way that I did not realize from doing the first cycle of MFW. So the question is mostly along the lines of clarifying my interpretation of what I was reading: I am seeing signs of teaching 'thinking skills', am I seeing it clearly and correctly?

I am now looking forward to reading through a 1 inch stack of notes for an even more complete picture of MFW and where it goes through the years.

Thank you ladies!

[cbollin]

1. Doesn't MFW more than adequately prepare students for college? As I went through 'how' the various books are used & writing is assigned on the grids it just seemed to me like plenty of work was being done from my memory of school. I was even in a gifted program, and I don't remember doing nearly so much for my school studies.

Glad you see that! It's hard to believe internet people but when you see it out there like that. or seeing the high school student notebooks at convention....... I've been seeing the same thing... . I was in public schools. I was top of my class of over 120 students. Attended and graduated from one of the top 30 universities in the world.. I don't think I did this much in high school....

also.. I think narration is a great beginning to thinking skills..... processing thing of course. and then various thinking skills in concrete learning stages with various puzzles and puzzle books... math with singapore... and not always having scripts and such for what does this scripture mean........ it's little things that add up.......... progeny press later in years.... it's little stuff that adds over the years....

I do hope you enjoying the browsing their booth... comfy shoes.. water...

[Julie in MN]

Just wondering how many of you have used MFW from K through 12?

Hello,
There won't be many K-12 users so far. 12th grade came out in 2011, I believe. Of course there were pilot families, and Hazell kids before that, but they wouldn't have used all of the same materials in the final versions, in most cases. And not many are online boardies. I do personally know one gal at convention started with MFW-K and her oldest is in 11th, like mine, but that mom isn't online. I know her son is very bright and very successful in his activities, having won a variety of awards, from cycling to Royal Rangers.

This thread has quite a few long-time MFW users chiming in:
http://board.mfwbooks.com/viewtopic.php ... 695#p86695

I do hope you get some folks to chime in, but if not, maybe if you add to your question, you might get responses from folks who have used MFW for quite a few years, even if not 13 years.

My youngest son started using MFW in 3rd grade. At that time, MFW only went through CTG or maybe RTR, I can't recall. He is now in 11th grade, using US1. So he's used MFW from 3rd through 11th grades. Alongside MFW, he also took 2 college courses last semester, and will start 2 more tomorrow for this semester.

When I compare his education to my oldest son, who was public schooled and is a working petroleum engineer right now, I feel my youngest son's education has been so much richer and more memorable. My boys each have their weaknesses and strengths, but I am so grateful to have been able to spend more time with my youngest through homeschooling, and to teach him the things I felt were important, rather than things someone else assigned. Marie Hazell has a way of choosing the materials that I would have chosen, and planning them in such a way that they really get done.

When I compare homeschooling my youngest, who used MFW, to my middle dd, who was homeschooled before MFW had high school, I am so grateful for having MFW and not spending all my evenings and weekends doing planning, re-adjusting my plans, purchasing and reselling -- and still having the benefits of homeschooling. Of course, when I wanted to tailor something in MFW to my child, I did, but my family time could come first. It's also been such a gift to have a good idea of what "other kids" have accomplished in a day with the materials we are using, so I have a general idea of whether I'm expecting too much or too little. Again, I can and have adjusted things at times, but I'm not starting from scratch.

Hope that helps a little?
Julie

[dhudson]

My oldest is in 10th grade and has used all the programs except 1st grade. My twins have used all of MFW and are in the 6th grade. So far, I have used every MFW program except for the last two years. The more years I have used, the more I have loved the education my kids are getting. My oldest is doing very well and we are more than pleased at both the Academic and Biblical Education our kids are getting.

[DS4home]

I am so excited I have to share!

My son has done MFW since Kindergarten, and is currently working through the high school WHL year. So he is a sophomore now. I just took him to our local community college to take the ACT COMPASS test. This is not the full ACT test but the COMPASS test that they use for placement purposes.
I am proud to say that he did very well! This is a student who hates writing and complains all the way through. He just passed the COMPASS English portion with scores in the high 80's. He qualifies to take college level English Comp. 101, and he's still a sophomore! I am astounded, if you knew my son you would be too!

He has not really been a stellar student, he does his work because he has too, but I'm testifying that the high school prep has been good. He did Writing Strands 3 and 4, All in One English, and Applications of Grammar before high school. In high school I would say all the essay writing he did last year in AHL and the writing from this year using Writers INC has been just what he needed. He is now ready to start building up some college credits to his name while completing high school.

Thank You MFW for such an excellent curriculum through and through!

Proud Momma,
Dawn

[sbbrown425]

Congratulations! And I am so excited to hear your testimony. This high school journey is scary and it's great to hear the success stories.
To God be the Glory!