Singapore - Supplements needed? Extra workbooks, other topic

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cbollin

Singapore - Supplements needed? Extra workbooks, other topic

Unread post by cbollin » Mon Mar 13, 2006 4:31 pm

burg wrote:I know Singapore doesn't follow the US standards exactly, and doesn't teach as many topics that are usually done in US math classes, like probability, coordinate graphing, and some data analysis.

So, what do you use or suggest to use for supplementing those topics not covered in Singapore Math? I know my kids are young, but I'd like to get this info now ahead of time anyway. Thanks!
When I find that I need to supplement a specific topic in math, I tend to not buy a whole other program. The one time I did buy something else, I found I was not happy trying to juggle two books and two programs. No matter how much I was just trying to use a tiny bit. It just didn't work that way.

So, before you go out and try to supplement Singapore, give it a chance to see if it is enough. Looked at the scope and sequence of the next math book in the series and see if it is covered. Look at what your state schools would be covering -- even if you don't have to do what they do.

I'm hoping that you help you a bit to not rush out to buy too much at one time.

Crystal

Fly2Peace
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Unread post by Fly2Peace » Mon Mar 13, 2006 5:57 pm

I think Crystal has the right idea, supplement on as needed, not a second curriculum set, and keep it simple. If they are strong in the basics, the other will come, because they will understand math concepts. That is my opinion...
Fly2Peace (versus flying to pieces)

Julie in MN
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Unread post by Julie in MN » Mon Mar 13, 2006 11:08 pm

Fly2Peace wrote:If they are strong in the basics, the other will come, because they will understand math concepts.
Teresa,
I totally agree with Fly2Peace's comment that in math you are teaching problem-solving and thinking, rather than a checklist of applications. However, regarding your two questions:

1. Again I agree with the others that Singapore really is enough, but that if you wish to supplement, you will find it easier to buy a little workbook on a narrow topic. It depends on the age of your student, but a local "teacher's store" or books like Key To Decimals should do the trick, if you are worried about a gap.

Every math program is a little different, and believe me the public schools change their plans midstream all the time. They don't seem to worry too much about kids who were partway thru the "old" program & will miss a piece or two in the transition, or kids who transfer in from a completely different school system. I really think most of these "side topics" are just barely introduced until you get into the upper grades.

2. Drill must be supplemented in any math program (& any classroom). I think the key is to do it regularly (daily if possible).
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Sue in MN
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Unread post by Sue in MN » Tue Mar 14, 2006 12:12 am

Considering the fact that Singapore students outshine US students in math competitions why would you want to follow the US standards?

I prefer to stick with the basics and let those other areas alone until they are older. I think Singapore has a wide variety of stuff that they do teach well that there is no need to add to it unless your dc needs more work in something Singapore taught that your dc didn't understand.

burg
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Joined: Mon Feb 06, 2006 5:06 pm

thank you all

Unread post by burg » Tue Mar 14, 2006 9:33 am

Those are great suggestions. I just need to learn to relax. I'm tend to be a perfectionist and that's doesn't make for the best situation when there are too many choices, if you know what I mean.
Teresa

cbollin

Any "extras" needed with Singapore?

Unread post by cbollin » Fri Apr 25, 2008 2:25 pm

Posted: Wed Aug 01, 2007 4:14 pm
The only extra practice that I thought was needed was in the earlier books and that was accomplished by adding drills -- not by adding more workbooks.

In the upper books, there are lots of "practice" sections for more problems if needed. And this is without needing the extra practice books that Singapore has, but not sold by MFW. I don't think it is needed by my kid. You have the problems from the text that you work together and then the student workbook. Additional "practice" problems and "reviews" are in the text book.

General thoughts -- I really like Singapore more and more, the more that I use it. Not too many problems on the page. Challenging stuff built in without having to get extra books. I like the teaching style with the pictures --- it's like reading a Lego instruction book with pictures. Love the bar diagrams for thinking skills with word problems.

I have mixed review on the HIG. I can understand some teachers needing it. It has lots of good stuff in it. I'm a little concerned that I will over teach 6A if I am not careful with the HIG. Singapore 6A textbook doesn't deal with the names of pre-algebra (coefficient, variable, the term algebraic expression, etc.). At some point, she will need that vocabulary and it certainly is there in the HIG. I started to over-teach those terms to my oldest (6th grade) today and it wasn't all that important all of a sudden.

I just need to be more careful that I don't over do it (that's a me problem, not a book problem). It's like with grammar --- do you really need all of the grammar vocabulary before a certain age?

hth
crystal

erikdeb
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Extra Practice Singapore

Unread post by erikdeb » Thu Apr 01, 2010 12:28 pm

LSH in MS wrote:Has anyone used the extra practice or Intensive Practice books for Singapore in addition to Primary Math? Has any of your children needed additional practice than what is provided in Singapore? If you have used these books what did you think of them?
I have used/am using them both. My ds does need additional practice, and I like to do different topics in each book, to keep him remembering how to do the different things.

The Intensive Practice is HARD. It makes ME have to think a lot (and we are talking 1B) sometimes. I wouldn't recommend it for someone who just needs extra practice. The Extra Practice books are good for that. I DO take him through the Intensive Practice, because we have it, but I have to walk him through most of it, as it is tricky, and more for "advanced" students. It takes the thinking a step farther.
Deb, Mom to Isaac-8, Noah-6, Lydia-4, Micah-3, Simon-1
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cbollin

Re: Extra Practice Singapore

Unread post by cbollin » Sat Apr 03, 2010 9:29 pm

I've been thinking of the Extra Practice books that are from the frank schaffer publishing to use with my youngest while she does Primary 1A. We're just getting into 1A with her and with all of her special needs, I figure it couldn't hurt to have extra. Those books are easy to find at a local teacher supply store.

-crystal

Mommyto3boys
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Re: Extra Practice Singapore

Unread post by Mommyto3boys » Sun Apr 04, 2010 1:19 pm

I have used the intensive practice books. I started using them when my oldest was in 2nd or 3rd grade. (He was using Miquon Math with Singapore and decided he didn't like Miquon as well). Usually I have my oldest ds work 1 book back to keep reviewing the material. It does have a lot of harder problems than what is done in their workbook. I do choose to skip some of the problems. I also have my ds use the Challenging Word Problems (which is no longer in print) a year behind his level. He is a mathy student and I like giving him (and sometimes me) a challenge in word problems. My 2nd ds has started using the challenging word problems. It has really helped him understand word problems and when he should add or subtract based on the problem. He works one book back as well. I plan to start him in the intensive practice books as well since he is a very good math student.

HTH,

Debbie in NC
Mom to 3 ds (11, 8, and 5) and 1 dd (3)

Julie in MN
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Re: Extra Practice Singapore

Unread post by Julie in MN » Mon Apr 05, 2010 10:37 pm

I put my extra time into math facts practice. We did a LOT of that some years, up through fractions. We're revisiting the fractions this year during algebra.

Sometimes we'd take a break from the Singapore lessons, to let my ds just sit in a place for a while and let it absorb. We'd sometimes move to measuring units in Singapore, play math games, do another math book -- but more of the same would not have gone over well :~

The only Singapore extra I had was CWP-6. We did a little of it during Algebra this year when we needed a break, but didn't do any of it during Singapore 6. I had a hard time scheduling it in, because it isn't parceled out like the regular text/workbook lessons. There will be a whole section in the extra book that corresponds to a whole chapter in the text.

So we used Singapore for 5 years with no extra Singapore materials, and ds is doing well in Algebra in 8th grade, so that's another option.

Julie
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Fly2Peace
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Singapore Math Books ?

Unread post by Fly2Peace » Tue Feb 01, 2011 9:47 am

shera wrote:I am currently using Singapore Math but I am wondering does anyone use the Intensive Practice books or Challenging Word Problems Book? I currently use them but I'm not sure if I should continue or not. Then again I'm not sure if ds is getting it or not. He's in a phase of not wanting to put forth any real effort.
I have one that finished all Singapore, and we never did any extra workbooks, just used the MFW schedule as written. My next one is doing the same so far. It has worked for us.
Fly2Peace (versus flying to pieces)

jasntas
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Re: Singapore Math Books ?

Unread post by jasntas » Tue Feb 01, 2011 10:01 am

My ds uses Singapore without the extra workbooks and does fine. Mine is always in a phase of ‘not wanting to put forth any real effort'.

I have thought about getting the Intensive Practice Books but would only use the sections I think my ds would need extra practice in. So I would only use them as 'extra practice' when needed. Not in addition. We would never be finished with math around here if I used them all. HTH
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mdarce
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Singapore question

Unread post by mdarce » Mon Mar 25, 2013 5:45 pm

hsm wrote:I will be ordering ECC and K. I have decided to follow MFW recommendations in language arts after much prayer, the helpful responses I received on here, and an extremely helpful and encouraging conversation with Lucy. I am also very strongly considering switching to Singapore for my daughters, again after my conversation with Lucy. I am so taken aback by her grace and patience with all of my questions. What a wonderful testament to the kind of company this is.

My oldest has tested several levels behind which I understand is not surprising. We will have a lot of catching up to do as she is midway through her 5th grade year and tested in at 2B. I am planning to order Singapore immediately and not wait until the next school year to start so that we can try to get caught up. It is a bit nerve wracking to switch from what we are currently using (a computer based math program that does the teaching for me). She does well but I think she needs a better understanding of math rather than just plugging in numbers and memorizing which she is fantastic at doing by the way :) . She struggles in mental math and math is probably her least favorite subject. All that said, I do feel that this may be what we need to do. It will be a commitment from both of us to get her caught up by the end of next year.

So my two questions are: 1. For a non-math person such as myself, would you recommend the instructor's guide or does the text do the job well enough? 2. Do you recommend the extra practice books? Some reviews I have read about Singapore notes the lack of practice problems. I am not sure if the people who feel this way like tons of practice/drill/busy work or if there really is something to this. Thoughts?
Hello! I , personally, have found the Home instructors Guide to be very helpful. At level 2 it may not be quite as necessary as at the upper levels , but if you aren't " math minded" you might consider it. Singapore is quite different than traditional programs and even at the earlier levels the manual shows some different ways of approaching things, especially word problems .

Also, the HIG has additional mental math drills in the back appendix.

As far as additional practice books, I can't speak for anyone else, but for us, if my daughter has gotten stuck on a particular concept,i have been known to pick up an extra practice book.

Many blessings,
Michelle

hsm
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Re: Singapore question

Unread post by hsm » Tue Mar 26, 2013 11:41 am

Thank you for your response Michelle! I am so nervous about switching math just because what we are doing now is adequate and my daughter really doesn't like math. And, I am a bit math phobic myself so I am afraid to try something that may be hard for me to teach. However, I want her to understand and know math not just skate through a program because it is easy for both of us. Sounds like we would benefit from the HIG and practice books. Maybe I will try it without them first and see how it goes. We are starting at 2B so maybe I won't need it quite yet....Oh, boy, decisions...decisions! I think my decision is made-I just have to find the courage to just make the change already and quit mulling over it. ;)

Blessings to you!
Lori-IL
K/ECC, CtG/Learning God's Story
dd-12, dd-9, ds-6

Julie in MN
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Re: Singapore question

Unread post by Julie in MN » Tue Mar 26, 2013 11:55 am

hsm wrote: 1. For a non-math person such as myself, would you recommend the instructor's guide or does the text do the job well enough?
2. Do you recommend the extra practice books? Some reviews I have read about Singapore notes the lack of practice problems. I am not sure if the people who feel this way like tons of practice/drill/busy work or if there really is something to this. Thoughts?
Hi Lori,
(1) I'm going to lean on the side of not getting the instructor guides until you see a need. I got them, I'm not critical of them, but I just think that they can overload and take the focus away from the Singapore textbook lessons. Or, if you get them, maybe set them aside until you need them?

Real success with Singapore I think comes with the parent sitting down and "teaching" the textbook as if it's the blackboard. The textbook starts with pictures, moves to thought bubbles, and finally presents problems in math symbols. Along the way, the parent/teacher notices whether the student needs reinforcement with manipulatives, or needs to go back to the more concrete part of the lesson.

Another good resource with Singapore is this forum and the Singapore Math forum, where you can get help thinking through problems in new ways.

(2) The Singapore workbooks can be done any way the student likes, but the lesson teaches new ways to think about problems, which might not be needed right away as the student maybe able to come up with the correct answer to easier problems without using the new methods, but the exposure to those methods will definitely come in handy when things get harder. So I wonder if kids who do more workbooks will really reinforce their old ways of doing things rather than getting extra exposure to more of the new ways of thinking? Just a thought, but it's the textbooks I love in Singapore, more than the workbooks (although my son liked the workbooks since they were usually fairly easy and had a few puzzles and such).

I'm not sure what folks mean about practice problems. A big part of repetition is drill work on math facts, and yes, that needs more more more! But that's done outside the workbooks. Other kinds of repetition to me seem like kids memorizing standard ways of doing things by doing them over and over, such as long division, but I'm not sure that's what Singapore is really about? There is repetition built in as you advance, since later skills use the earlier skills as well, but those are more diverse ways of reinforcement. I don't know, sometimes my son needed a break and we used something else to hover in place, so maybe that's what folks are doing when they get the other Singapore workbooks - just hovering and not pushing ahead. My son preferred a total change of scenery when these bumps came along, rather than more of the same, but I may be more used to winging it than some, since he's my youngest :)

I did buy one of the extra books when my ds was near the end of Singapore Primary Math, but it wasn't all scheduled out for me, and the answer key was very brief, so I found it a bit hard to use. Maybe that was just me?

Julie
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Mom2theteam
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Re: Singapore question

Unread post by Mom2theteam » Tue Mar 26, 2013 12:56 pm

Having only skimmed the other responses....

I would absolutely get the HIG (Home Instructor's Guide). I can do math, but I don't remember the processes nor do I have a clue how to teach it. Personally, I would have no clue how to actually teach the text book without it (even if I could do the work). I could probably figure it out on lower levels, but I would definitely miss the "Singapore" way of teaching and doing math...definitely I would miss the mental component. We don't do all the activities included in the HIG. It's a lot. We do what we need to and move on. For some units, I only use the HIG, for some I only use the text (with the HIG being *my* guide in how to teach), but for most, I use both. I've seen so many people say it's not needed and I truly don't understand it because to me it is essential to teaching Singapore. Of course, that is just me. :~

As for extra practice, right now, we don't have any extra practice other than the workbook. However, I am going to buy Challenging Word Problems and possible one of the other practice books to have around as supplement as needed. I'd like to have extra practice available for units that I feel it's needed. The word problems, I think it's just a good thing to be good at. I've read people use this book a half level behind as review. I may do that...not totally sure yet, but those are my thoughts on the extra books. :-)
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hsm
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Re: Singapore question

Unread post by hsm » Wed Mar 27, 2013 9:51 am

I just placed my order for Singapore! I can't wait until I can order ECC and K in the next month or so. Very excited to start anew! Thank you to everyone for their responses. I will think about all of the responses and keep all of these thoughts in mind as I decide whether to get the HIG and/or extra books. I figure once I get the textbooks and workbooks in my hands, maybe I will have a better idea which side of the fence I fall on. :) I really appreciate this board and the advice everyone offers. It feels like a personal support group. :-) Wish me luck on our new math journey...nervous but very optimistic!
Lori-IL
K/ECC, CtG/Learning God's Story
dd-12, dd-9, ds-6

asheslawson
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Re: Singapore question

Unread post by asheslawson » Thu Mar 28, 2013 10:43 pm

Julie in MN wrote:Hi Lori,
(1) I'm going to lean on the side of not getting the instructor guides until you see a need. I got them, I'm not critical of them, but I just think that they can overload and take the focus away from the Singapore textbook lessons. Or, if you get them, maybe set them aside until you need them?
I lean towards Julie's 2nd response, get them but set them aside for when you need them. In a perfect world - I would review everything in the HIG & teach really well - but let's face it, it's not a perfect world. I teach pre-k kids I babysit, watch my infant granddaughter, and homeschool my youngest 2. I love that I have the HIG's for when something doesn't seem to be translating to my child well - or for a fun math "game". I also love how they give a little more detail on answers that need them (usually - sometimes I just need more detail than most - but I was not so good at math as a child and it's hard to teach).

I also agree that using the textbook to teach is the best method - although I seem to be grasping that better as I've been using Singapore a while now. Singapore takes a little time to learn to teach really well - but I think what I was missing was to relax and follow the textbook problems through with my child and make sure they understood why learning this way is good to learn - even though they can do the problem another way. (For example - my son would resist doing mentally, when he knew how to carry & borrow, and that was just easier for him. My daughter processes mental math much better than he did. He also tested fairly behind when I pulled him out of public school in 4th, & I put him in 2A. He is progressing - and I'm seeing benefits to his having learned the mental process.)

I want to also add that when I just can't figure out a problem - Julie is right - this forum & the Singapore Math forum are IMMENSELY helpful!!

Lastly - as far as the intensive practice guides...I bought one - really hoping that they were just extra practice problems for a child that needed a little more drill. I bought 5A. We never finished it - they really are, to me, more geared toward a very math-y child who needs more work...IMHO. There is some drill - which was great - but many of the problems were far more challenging - and left him frustrated. I mean - I worked in an accounting department for 15 years - and many of them truly stumped me! If he needs extra practice on something - I've done a little better finding free worksheets on online math sites. Lots of info - but math has been something I have really placed a great deal of importance on teaching well...and I have concerns about hindering their progress through my weaknesses. All in all - I am glad we have stuck through it with Singapore - even though we have done it year round to help him get caught up - though we took breaks on other subjects. It is paying off and I do see where the program is helping him.
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hsm
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Re: Singapore question

Unread post by hsm » Fri Mar 29, 2013 9:12 am

Thanks for the reply. I am leaning toward purchasing them and using only as needed. Which, in my case, as needed could be all the time! :~ Math is not my strong suit. I am not terrible but like a previous person posted, I may not remember it all or be able to teach it well, especially mental math.

Looking online, it seems that I need a guide for each semester, correct? And each guide is $17.50 plus I am doing two kids at a time (one of which will be doing a lot of books this year to catch up). Doing the math ;) this will add up quickly. I guess on the bright side, I will be able to re-use them for my younger kids...
Lori-IL
K/ECC, CtG/Learning God's Story
dd-12, dd-9, ds-6

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