## Singapore 4A, Specific Lessons

TriciaMR
Posts: 987
Joined: Thu Sep 20, 2007 11:43 am

### Re: Singapore 4A Text pg.37 onwards

Lindy,

I let my kids do whatever they need on paper, whenever they need to. Yes, Singapore is suppose to improve "mental math" but *I* don't think that means "do it all in your head." *I* think that means being able to figure out *how* to solve the problem, or the best way to solve the problem. If he needs to write numbers down, it is fine. Really.

Also, the mental math is for the estimation of the double digit multiplication, and the problem is to be written down in any of the methods that make sense. He really doesn't have to keep it all in his head
Trish - Wife to Phil, Mom to Toni(18), Charlie(14), and Trent(14)
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MFW-Lucy

### Re: Singapore 4A Text pg.37 onwards

Dear Lindy,

I wanted to assure you that it is o.k. for him to write down the progression to get to his final answer. On page 38 of the textbook the transition is being made to vertical multiplication and it is not expected to be completed mentally. Numbers 5, 6 and 7 are showing how to complete these kinds of problems on paper. You will work all the problems on the bottom of page 39 on paper. I agree with Trish that estimation can be complete mentally, but it is not expected that the actual problem would be. Estimation helps kids to have an idea of what the actual answer to the problem should be. It is a good self-checking method.

If you need more help with any concepts or specific problems as you move through the books please let us know. Since you may not be able to call, e-mail us with the book, pages, and exact problems or lesson you are struggling with and we will do our best to answer you via e-mail.

Lucy
TriciaMR
Posts: 987
Joined: Thu Sep 20, 2007 11:43 am

### Using the expression "through" in Singapore math? 4a, pg. 11

albanyaloe wrote:Okay, this is going to sound kinda funny... but we're from South Africa, and we speak a different kind of English Please bear with me.

I have noticed since being in contact with you lovely ladies from the US that you use the term "through". For example, you could say, MFW uses Singapore Math Grade 2 through Grade 6, and that means including Grade 6. In South Africa we would say MFW uses Singapore Math Grade from Grade 2 to Grade 6, or from Grade 2 until Grade 6.

So... now we have a problem. (And I'm not very mathy) We have an exercise in Singapore (Level 4a,Ex 46, workbook pg 117) where my son must draw a line through the point P So he drew the line right past the point P. I am not sure, in US language, does it not mean the line must stop at point P? Or must he extend it beyond P ?

Please could someone clarify this for us, we're a little confused.

Thanks so much,
Lindy
Lindy,

"Through the point" means on past the point. Like this:

------------------------------------.----------->

where the . is the point P.
Trish - Wife to Phil, Mom to Toni(18), Charlie(14), and Trent(14)
2014-2015 - AHL, CTG
2015-2016 - WHL, RTR
2016-2017 - EXP1850, US1877
2017-2018 - DE, 1850MOD
2018-2019 - College, AHL
My blog
MFW-Lucy

### Re: Using the expression "through" in Singapore math?

Hi Lindy,

Just writing to say that I spent 3 months in England years ago and different words and expressions definitely have differing meaning from U.S. English, so I can feel your pain . Just confirming what Tricia already said. You can also see in the textbook p. 80, #2 they do show the line extending beyond the point when using the word "through". If you have more questions, just let us know.

Lucy
albanyaloe
Posts: 40
Joined: Sun Apr 29, 2012 11:17 am

### Re: Using the expression "through" in Singapore math?

Good visual there, thank you, that worked for me.
I see now, pg 80. I just bombed out and packed it away yesterday!

Yes, clearly we don't all speak the same English in the English speaking world, not even in England, as the play Pygmalion always reminds us. But I actually love it, it helps us grow and learn more about others and be tolerant.

Thank you so much,
Regards,
Lindy
Lindy,
Our first year with MFW, doing ECC 2012, Our 7th year of HS'ing
Joel 11 yo, Emma-lee 8 yo and Shelley 6 yo
We're from Sunny South Africa!
Cyndi (AZ)
Posts: 543
Joined: Mon Jun 18, 2007 4:22 pm

### stuck on a couple math problems

hsm wrote:I have a couple of Singapore questions I am struggling with. The first one is simple (or it should be) but I need some help understanding it.

Round 6349 to the nearest 100. *I* would make it 6400 because the 49 bumps to 50 which bumps the 300 to 400 (this is how I would answer it), But, the answer is 6300. So, do they only look at the number directly to the right of the number rounding to...in this case the 4, not taking the other following numbers into account?
Yes. And it's not the first time that's been asked, so you're definitely not the only one that stopped and thought, "What?!"
hsm wrote:Now, a harder story problem that I am stuck on. It is in Workbook 4A Review 2, page 64 problem 21. I will type it up here in case you don't have a book to reference.

2500 people took part in a cross country race. The number of adults were 4 times the number of children. If there were 1200 men, how many women were there? I can usually figure these kind out, but for some reason, I am stuck on this one. Anyone?

TIA!
The first thing to do is divide the 2500 by 5 to find out the 4 units of adults to the 1 unit of children. (Four times as many adults.) That gives 2000 adults to 500 children.

Then, subtract the 1200 men from the 2000 adults and that leaves you with 800 women.

Hopefully someone else will jump in with better words to explain it.
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hsm
Posts: 146
Joined: Wed Jan 02, 2013 8:09 pm

### Re: stuck on a couple math problems

Thank you! I get it now! I don't know why I couldn't wrap my mind around it today. &) And, glad to hear I am not the only one who thinks the rounding is odd!

Thanks, Cyndi!
Lori-IL
K/ECC, CtG/Learning God's Story
dd-12, dd-9, ds-6
TriciaMR
Posts: 987
Joined: Thu Sep 20, 2007 11:43 am

### Re: stuck on a couple math problems

That's how rounding is done... Just look at the number right before. But, if you look at the "49" as a whole, then you see that it is less than 50' so the number should still be 6300. That's why you can just look at the number just to the right of the place value. We don't cumulatively round up.

So, 6349 is closer to 6300. 6351 is closer to 6400. That's why you don't make the 9 round the 4 up to 5 and then round the 3 up to 4. You've really got to look at the number in the whole... But, because of the way numbers work, you can just look at the number next door.

My dd made up a story to go with rounding. If you were 5 and bigger, that made you tall enough to ride on the big rides of the amusement park, so you jumped up. If you were 4 and under, you were stuck on the kiddie rides, so you stayed the same.
Trish - Wife to Phil, Mom to Toni(18), Charlie(14), and Trent(14)
2014-2015 - AHL, CTG
2015-2016 - WHL, RTR
2016-2017 - EXP1850, US1877
2017-2018 - DE, 1850MOD
2018-2019 - College, AHL
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Amy C.
Posts: 200
Joined: Thu Apr 30, 2009 9:12 am

### Re: stuck on a couple math problems

TriciaMR wrote: Just look at the number right before
TriciaMR wrote:you can just look at the number next door
This is the way we do it as well. This is the way I learned to round up or down. I don't know that I have ever heard of doing it the other way.
TriciaMR wrote:My dd made up a story to go with rounding. If you were 5 and bigger, that made you tall enough to ride on the big rides of the amusement park, so you jumped up. If you were 4 and under, you were stuck on the kiddie rides, so you stayed the same.
Good way to remember!

Amy C.
hsm
Posts: 146
Joined: Wed Jan 02, 2013 8:09 pm

### Re: stuck on a couple math problems

Interesting.... this really was a new way of doing it for me. I wonder if I was taught differently or remember differently? Well, nonetheless, thanks for explaining it. It makes sense the way you worded it.
Lori-IL
K/ECC, CtG/Learning God's Story
dd-12, dd-9, ds-6
Cyndi (AZ)
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### need help with Singapore 4A problem - workbook pg. 91, revie

hsm wrote:pg. 91 in 4A workbook(review 3):
Devi bought 8 m of ribbon. She made 6 bows. She used 5/8 m of ribbon for each bow. How much ribbon did she have left?

Can someone help me with this? I am stuck. And, can someone (anyone) please tell me that they also have trouble with solving these problems too? I feel a little shall we say...inadequate...teaching my child 4/5th grade level math and struggling with some of the problems. &)
6 bows @ 5/8m each = 6 X 5/8 = 6X5/8 = 30/8 = 3 6/8 = 3 3/4 So, she needs 3 3/4m for the bows.

She started with 8m. 8 - 3 3/4 = 4 1/4m The answer is that she had 4 1/4m of ribbon left.

To be honest, I have found myself solving a problem with algebra, then going backwards to figure out the Singapore way to do it. Some of these problems are head-scratchers! I have no idea how Saxon is going to be next year, either . . .
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Julie in MN
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### Re: need help with Singapore 4A problem

hsm wrote:And, can someone (anyone) please tell me that they also have trouble with solving these problems too? I feel a little shall we say...inadequate...teaching my child 4/5th grade level math and struggling with some of the problems. &)
I'd say that if your student isn't having any trouble with any of the problems, then he should push forward quickly to another level. Singapore isn't the kind of mindless plug-and-chug math we grew up with. The goal isn't to "get where to plug in the numbers," but to learn to think about what we can do with numbers in order to solve our real-life situations, and not every one will have an instant solution that comes to mind. As my son's algebra video teacher said, computers can do the calculations for companies, computer techs can program the computer to do the calculations, but someone has to understand what we need the computer to do.

Anywhooo, I thought I'd show how we would have approached a Singapore problem, in case it helps to see someone's thinking process.
hsm wrote:Devi bought 8 m of ribbon. She made 6 bows. She used 5/8 m of ribbon for each bow. How much ribbon did she have left?
So, I might use the marker board and write it out this way...

Hmm, la de da, drawing whatever comes to mind...

/--------8 m. ribbon----------/
/--bow--/--bow--/--bow--/--bow--/--bow--/--bow--/
/--5-8th m--/--5-8th m--/--5-8th m--/--5-8th m--/--5-8th m--/--5-8th m--/

Oh, there's left-over, too, so it's
/--5-8th m--/--5-8th m--/--5-8th m--/--5-8th m--/--5-8th m--/--5-8th m--/--left-over--/

and all that equals 8 m., so it's
/--5-8th m--/--5-8th m--/--5-8th m--/--5-8th m--/--5-8th m--/--5-8th m--/--left-over--/ = 8 m.

I guess I'd better add up all those 5/8ths, then subtract them from 8 m. to get the left-over.
(Then I let Cindy to the calculation .)

Just thought it would help to visualize someone else's thinking through the problem?
Julie
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hsm
Posts: 146
Joined: Wed Jan 02, 2013 8:09 pm

### Re: need help with Singapore 4A problem

Ahhh! Thank you both! You each gave different ways of looking at it. I was almost there; just couldn't get that final step down for some reason. I really hope I don't keep hitting bumps. I need to get through the next few books! Eeek! Anyways, thank you both very much.
Last edited by hsm on Tue Feb 04, 2014 5:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Lori-IL
K/ECC, CtG/Learning God's Story
dd-12, dd-9, ds-6