Science - Apologia General help starting/transitioning/Mod 1

Issues specific to teaching 6th to 8th graders, including the transition to Saxon math, Apologia science, Progeny Press guides, and grammar lessons
IdahoGrown
Posts: 33
Joined: Sat Feb 06, 2010 6:15 pm

Science other than Apologia

Unread post by IdahoGrown » Thu Jan 10, 2013 9:12 am

momonthemove wrote:I have a 7th grader using the Apologia General Science. It's not too hard, just the writing style really is a challenge for us. We are much more concrete. So, if I were to look at something else for 8th and high school science, any suggestions?
Take a look at Tiner books. We have several of them. They are excellent and my dd has really enjoyed them.
I would recommend, for a seventh grader, to start with The History of Medicine and then Exploring the World of Biology. We would take two, sometimes three, days per chapter. And if you get library books to supplement (totally not needed, but fun) then these two books could possibly last you the rest of this school year.

Gary Parker has some really good stuff too. We are starting Building Blocks of Life Science. We are in the first chapter about genetics and it is tough for my 8th grader. The rest of the chapters don't look so difficult, but this first one has been a doozy. : )

Hopefully this will give you some different ideas! It seems so hard to find a good textbook based science that isn't either dry or teaching to the end of chapter test. : (
Jean
Mom to dd 13 and ds 8
Hs'ing since 2004.
Using Adventures and RtR 2011-2012

Previous cores used: CtG 2010-2011

Julie in MN
Posts: 2925
Joined: Mon Jun 28, 2004 3:44 pm
Location: Minnesota

Science alternative for 7th/8th

Unread post by Julie in MN » Fri Apr 26, 2013 6:43 pm

momtogc wrote:I've spent a little bit of time looking over an Apologia General Science book, and I'm looking at some other options and could use some input.

I'm considering Answers in Genesis: God's Design series. Even though we used their Properties of Ecosystmes in ECC, the AIG website says it's for grades 3-8.

There is another book coming out from Apologia, in the Young Explorers author, Jeannie Fulbright, called Exploring Creation with Chemistry and Physics. I know it's not out yet, but just wondering if by and large this series is "too young" for a seventh grader?

I might also look at what Bob Jones has for science, although I don't really want to spend that much money on one subject.

I don't want to "mess up" and not adequately prepare my child for high school science, so choosing a good replacement for the coming year is very important. If you have used another curriculum for 7th and 8th grade science, I'd love to hear about your experiences. Thank-you!
Hi,
My, this topic has come up several times lately. About the other things you mentioned:

1. AIG could be done at that age. I think they recommend doing 3 of their books a year, and you'd do all the experiments in the 3 books for your labs.

2. The Apologia Young Explorers seem borderline for junior high. I always see them mentioned for elementary school. The other ones not used in MFW are all zoology, and it would seem like you'd need to use all 3 zoology books, since it would seem strange to have a course about "1/3 of zoology" (maybe less than 1/3, since I don't think all animals are covered even in the 3 books?). There is some good info in those, but maybe not a lot of prep for high school level science? I don't know, just make sure that in some other areas (math, grammar), your student is stepping up towards high school type work so 9th grade isn't a shock %|

3. If BJU textbooks cost a lot more, then they can't be all that different than Apologia textbooks, can they? LOL. I know 1st edition of Apologia didn't have a lot of colored pictures...

I'm not the norm, but I still had flexibility with my son in 7-8th grade science. However, one thing I noticed was that towards the middle of each year, he seemed to take a step forward and be ready for more, or less interested in kiddie info, if you know what I mean. He'd start out the year wanting to find something he was interested in and that was easy enough to absorb quickly, but somewhere during the year, I was often able to reintroduce textbook science. And we really aren't textbook folks here, but Apologia did have some really good things in there -- I remember the lesson on the layers of the earth and Mr. Wile carefully told the students that he was going to present information that was all theory -- no one has ever, with any length of drill, seen below the crust of the earth. Wow, an honest scientist!

Also, here are some helps that we sometimes used:
http://board.mfwbooks.com/viewtopic.php ... 305#p91305

Best wishes as you figure this out!
Julie
Julie, married 29 yrs, finding our way without Shane
(http://www.CaringBridge.org/visit/ShaneHansell)
Reid (21) college student; used MFW 3rd-12th grades (2004-2014)
Alexandra (29) mother; hs from 10th grade (2002)
Travis (32) engineer; never hs

RBS in OH
Posts: 43
Joined: Thu Nov 13, 2008 2:34 pm

Re: Science alternative for 7th/8th

Unread post by RBS in OH » Fri Apr 26, 2013 9:37 pm

When we studied human anatomy, we used MFW materials, but I got the Apologia book in addition. It was kept in the Book Basket, and sometimes I read portions of it to the kids to add to science--even did a couple of the experiments--will probably do the same next year when we study chem. and physics.

This book (the human anatomy one) was definitely more advanced than the astronomy and botany books, and I personally would feel very comfortable using it for a 7th grader. I think one of the reasons that Apologia labels it to 6th grade is because they already have a science curriculum for 7th. I would just suggest that a 7th grader do everything in the book, and have a high standard for the notebooking pages.

All of that said, it's just my opinion, and you know your dd best and where to go more gently or to increase the challenge to her. Also, I especially like the thoughts that Julie shared in her last paragraph; she's "been there and done that" and we are so blessed that she so freely shared her wisdom with us.

Blessings as you contemplate the choices,
Rachel

ds(14) 8) and dd(14) ;)
We've enjoyed ADV, ECC (2 times), CTG, RTR, EX-1850, 1850-MOD--and now AHL this year!

Wendy B.
Posts: 127
Joined: Tue Apr 07, 2009 6:27 pm

Re: Science alternative for 7th/8th

Unread post by Wendy B. » Fri Apr 26, 2013 11:02 pm

Bob Jones is harder to teach in a homeschool setting than Apologia. Bob Jones is written for a typical school setting and assumes a knowledgeable teacher. Just something to consider.

Jeannie Fulbright has stated in her FAQ on her website to not use her Elementary series with 7th grade up but to transition to General Science. On the Apologia website, she states that " ...older students need to move up to more challenging curriculum, especially in science." If the author of a program is stating that it is not appropriate for 7th grade up, then it probably isn't the best option. Perhaps she is just stating the party line to promote the upper level science. IDK.

Glazed over look means......boredom or struggle with the material?

General Science provided my older kids an opportunity to learn to answer questions on paper, study for a test, and write formal lab reports. Those types of skills aren't enjoyable but are necessary. IMHO, by the time they reach highschool, it is really to their benefit to know how to work through a textbook. It has been many years since General science so I don't remember a lot of details. I don't remember it being a "WOW" course, and I do remember a lot of grumbling about using a textbook. It took one of my older kids the whole course to develop a system to learn the material for the test. That child still uses the same process for college courses. Julie mentioned having some area that "steps" up towards highschool type work so that 9th grade isn't a shock. This is really great advice! For my older kids, General Science was their first big step towards highschool type work.

HTH
Wendy B.
Graduated ds '08 & dd '09
Homeschooling ds 11 & dd 8 using RtR
completed: MFW 1, ADV, ECC & CtG.

Aiming4Him
Posts: 5
Joined: Wed Apr 02, 2008 9:24 am

Re: Science alternative for 7th/8th

Unread post by Aiming4Him » Sun Apr 28, 2013 5:39 pm

I don't know your child's future goals for high school, but.... you could do the AIG curriculum in 7th and do General Science in 8th and Physical Science in 9th. For someone who isn't making a future in the science field there is still time in HS for biology and chemistry. I was a college prep student and that was the progression that I did. I even had Physics my senior year.

My daughter did Beautiful Feet's History of Science in 7th. A friend of mine taught the class. She's going to be in 8th this coming year and I'm still deciding. Anyway, I'm definitely doing Physical science in 9th. My daughter is a visual and hands on learner with some auditory processing issues and the whole text book thing, memorization and writing out answers is hard for her. She's been making progress and I think she'll be more ready for Apologia in 9th.

That's just my two cents!
Aimee,
wife to Mike,
mom to seven boys (16,14,10,8,5 ,3 & 1 ),
and one dd (12)

cjgrubbs
Posts: 8
Joined: Mon Mar 14, 2011 8:10 pm

Re: Science alternative for 7th/8th

Unread post by cjgrubbs » Sun Apr 28, 2013 8:28 pm

We are using AIG's books this year. I have a 7th, 4th and 1st grader. We did World of Animals first. it was way too easy for my 7th grader so I added in owl pellet dissection, sent him to a dissection class at our local science museum and required a report for each week on a specific animal. Then we did Machines & Motion. It was too hard for the 4th and 1st graders so I had 7th grader finish and I switched gears with the youngers. 7th grader is finishing up his year with Inventions & Technology. So if you want to use AIG God's Design - I recommend using the Physics books - I think they are the most appropriate for a 7th grader.

Edited: They are called Physical world, not physics! I also think the Chemistry & Ecology ones would be higher level.
DS1 - 8th grade
DS2 - 5th grade
DS3 - 2nd grade
DD1 - 4 - home from China since March 2013

Jamie
Posts: 22
Joined: Sun Dec 14, 2008 10:04 am
Location: Montana

Re: Science alternative for 7th/8th

Unread post by Jamie » Tue Apr 30, 2013 11:58 am

Wendy B. wrote:It took one of my older kids the whole course to develop a system to learn the material for the test. That child still uses the same process for college courses. Julie mentioned having some area that "steps" up towards highschool type work so that 9th grade isn't a shock. This is really great advice! For my older kids, General Science was their first big step towards highschool type work.
Wendy, I was curious as to what kind of a system your child used to learn the material for the test, as that is what has been our issue this year for my 13 yo son. I think that part of it has been a bit discouraging, so that was one reason we started looking a little elsewhere for next year's science. I'm sure we'll stick with Apologia, as it's too hard to pass up. :) Thank You!!
Jamie
Married to my sweetie for 16.5 years
14 ds, 12 dd, 10 dd, 7 ds, 4 ds, 1.5 dd
MFW K, ECC, CtG, RtR, Ex to 1850, & 14 yo currently in 1850 to Modern

Mommyto3boys
Posts: 32
Joined: Tue Mar 21, 2006 12:24 pm

Re: Science alternative for 7th/8th

Unread post by Mommyto3boys » Tue Apr 30, 2013 2:39 pm

For my ds, I would have him do some of the study guide questions after he read that section rather than doing it all at the end. This way he can make sure he understood the section. Also, I taught him that every day he should spend a little bit of time reviewing the previous day(s) work. This way he was not cramming for a test every two weeks and he could really understand the material. Since the tests always had a section of the definitions, he had to write out almost daily all the definitions that he had learned so far. I always had him to the module summary that is in the end of the book for each module one or two days for the test. This would let him know which areas he was still weak on.

It has helped him with the tests although he can still miss some questions if he is not reading the question carefully or hasn't studies as well as he should have.

HTH,
Debbie in NC
Mom to 3 ds (14, 11, and 8.5) and 1 dd (6)

Wendy B.
Posts: 127
Joined: Tue Apr 07, 2009 6:27 pm

Re: Science alternative for 7th/8th

Unread post by Wendy B. » Wed May 01, 2013 2:09 pm

She outlined the text and used her outline to answer the summary questions. She uses highlighters extensively. Vocabulary words would get one color, formulas another, etc. Her theory is that she can not have too many highlighters. Ha! She re-reads her notes/outlines/etc. daily in preparation for the test.

HTH
Wendy B.
Graduated ds '08 & dd '09
Homeschooling ds 11 & dd 8 using RtR
completed: MFW 1, ADV, ECC & CtG.

Jamie
Posts: 22
Joined: Sun Dec 14, 2008 10:04 am
Location: Montana

Re: Science alternative for 7th/8th

Unread post by Jamie » Wed May 01, 2013 4:45 pm

Thanks for the responses, ladies. I'll need to be good about encouraging my son to try some of this to help him with the tests. I really appreciate your time!!
Jamie
Married to my sweetie for 16.5 years
14 ds, 12 dd, 10 dd, 7 ds, 4 ds, 1.5 dd
MFW K, ECC, CtG, RtR, Ex to 1850, & 14 yo currently in 1850 to Modern

momofsix
Posts: 17
Joined: Wed Nov 12, 2008 4:28 pm

Re: Science alternative for 7th/8th

Unread post by momofsix » Fri May 03, 2013 1:41 pm

Forgive me if someone else already said this... as I skimmed some of the responses...
Have you thought about checking out the notebooks apologia has now for general science? Or getting the audio cd of the text?
I had the same thoughts as you about my DD cringing about general science this year, but had her do it anyway and she is surviving it! And did learn some things too :) and learned to work independently doing following the MFW schedule and doing the experiments. And we did use the more boring 1st edition...
HTH
Elissa in MN (really mom of 8 ) 3 boys: 16, 10, 7 & 5 girls: 13, 11, 5, 4, 1
Using: God's Creation from A to Z, Exploring Countries & Cultures, World History & Lit, Math-U-See, Sequential Spelling, Rod & Staff English...and more

homespun
Posts: 12
Joined: Sat Apr 28, 2012 2:18 pm

8th grade science help

Unread post by homespun » Fri Apr 04, 2014 7:02 pm

annaz wrote:I'm in a quandary over science. We're coming from doing Exploration Education Physical Science for 7th. We tried Apologia General at the beginning of this year and dd just despised it. Apologia Physical looks so much better, but I fear that another year of Physical could do her in for science. Of course [EE was] no where near in academic quality (IMO).

Any ideas for 8th grade science? We could use "Life" science, but not being sciency, I have no idea where to turn. Any ideas or topic ideas? Let me add that dd isn't particularly good at science, so doing Apologia Biology would not work.
Hello
My dd hated apologia science so I have also been looking around for something different for next year. Recently I received a catalog from Master Books. There are some interesting looking choices there. For the first time dd seemed interested as well. I will be looking for their booth when I am at convention next week.
annaz wrote:I received that book as well! It looked good! But there's no samples. I do have the encyclopedia-ish set: weather/caves/astronomy/etc... with the parent guide, but I know I'd need more help than that. But it looks like I"ll have to wait for the convention. I did notice that the World of Science that 1850MOD uses is there as well as the animals book and it says it's for up to middle grades. I wonder if it's enough??? Obviously no comparison to Apologia, however..... Our convention isn't until mid July. That would be totally last minute for me as we start Aug. 1st.
MFW user since 2006 beginning in K. Doing ECC synergy group this year for our second time with ECC.
dd grade 8, ds grade 6

Julie in MN
Posts: 2925
Joined: Mon Jun 28, 2004 3:44 pm
Location: Minnesota

Re: 8th grade science help

Unread post by Julie in MN » Fri Apr 04, 2014 9:44 pm

Here's a thread where we started talking about alternatives, and ended up talking about how to make Apologia work:
http://board.mfwbooks.com/viewtopic.php ... 305#p91303

You might find some different ideas if you wander in and out of the 3 pages of that archive.

My son perked up with Apologia once we started using the free online Virtual Homeschool Group. The lectures are really good, and the tests are somewhat easier as they are online multiple choice. I do think their labs are light and encourage extra labs at home (the group has good ideas for those, they just don't require them for grades, so you would have to make extra labs a requirement yourself).

I like to mention that if your student decides not to use Apologia in 7-8th, it's good to make sure they do some textbook learning in another area, since MFW really uses Apologia for that kind of skill-building rather than using textbooks in other subjects.

Julie
Julie, married 29 yrs, finding our way without Shane
(http://www.CaringBridge.org/visit/ShaneHansell)
Reid (21) college student; used MFW 3rd-12th grades (2004-2014)
Alexandra (29) mother; hs from 10th grade (2002)
Travis (32) engineer; never hs

annaz
Posts: 54
Joined: Fri Mar 24, 2006 7:34 pm

Re: 8th grade science help

Unread post by annaz » Sat Apr 05, 2014 10:47 am

Thanks Julie. Those are some great ideas for Apologia. DD had a really hard time with General. So they're saying Mod #4 it gets more interesting? We stopped at 3.

I also like reading along with the audio and the open book test scenario. I don't find EE really up to par for the age, but she did like it.

Julie in MN
Posts: 2925
Joined: Mon Jun 28, 2004 3:44 pm
Location: Minnesota

General Science Plans

Unread post by Julie in MN » Fri Apr 15, 2016 3:59 pm

Bandy wrote:
Fri Apr 15, 2016 3:42 pm
Hi, anyone know if there is a sample page I can view of the Apologia General Science Daily Lesson Plans?
Hi Bandy,
Yes there is!

Go to the science page on the website, and click on the "Lesson Plans" bar:
http://www.mfwbooks.com/products/22/Sci ... sson_Plans

Then click on the year you want to look at (written in blue).

Let us know if that doesn't make sense!
Julie
Bandy wrote:
Fri Apr 15, 2016 4:06 pm
Ah, there it is, thanks very much!
Julie, married 29 yrs, finding our way without Shane
(http://www.CaringBridge.org/visit/ShaneHansell)
Reid (21) college student; used MFW 3rd-12th grades (2004-2014)
Alexandra (29) mother; hs from 10th grade (2002)
Travis (32) engineer; never hs

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