Updates - 1st vs. 2nd Edition decisions, also using 2nd time

Post Reply
Julie - Staff
Posts: 1081
Joined: Fri Nov 03, 2006 11:52 am

Updates - 1st vs. 2nd Edition decisions, also using 2nd time

Unread post by Julie - Staff »

  • Current Student Sheets will work with all previous versions of ECC. 
  • If you own the first edition of Exploring Countries and Cultures, you can use it again and again as long as you keep all of the original books that match the Teacher's Manual.
  • However, If you are teaching a 7th or 8th grader, you will need the second edition.
  • You may exchange any ECC Teacher's Manual (TM) for a new Teacher's Manual for $58. Call our office to request an upgrade (573-202-2000). You will be given information about how to return your TM to our office. Once we receive your TM, a new manual will be sent to you.
  • If you are only teaching a 7th or 8th grader, some of the items may be optional. Please call our office at 573-202-2000 for help in placing an order.

- In 2014: All Teacher Manuals received cover changes to reflect the Discover/Investigate/Declare stages. The Currency Kit and Children's Atlas of God's World (replacing Illustrated World Atlas) were added. These may be easy to add, or you can use the materials you have.Here is a sample from Children's Atlas to compare with the book you have: https://www.mfwbooks.com/item/11748/Children-s-Atlas
- In 2016: The Classroom Atlas was expanded, and Properties of Ecosystems went to 4th edition.
- In 2017: (a) Student Sheets: Flag pages in Student Sheets are now in color. Current Student Sheets work with all previous manuals.
(b) Teacher's Manual: LLFT lesson numbers were added to weekly grids.
(c) 7-8th Grade Supplement: Kisses From Katie replaced Peace Child. If you have a 7th or 8th grader, you could use either book during those weeks.
- In 2017-2019: Book Basket was updated. (View the Brazil download on the MFW home page to compare.)
- In 2019: Revised edition of Window on the World.

Significant 2009 revisions and upgrades include:
• Much less photocopying required than before.
• Parent/Teacher Supplement with map masters and games, including a parent copy of the Geography Game.
• Student Sheets with full-color, ready-made Geography Game and new Geography Notebook pages (replacing the Appendix pages which previously had to be photocopied).
• Pre-printed passport
• New book on Bible translation: God Speaks Numanggang.
• For science, Wild Places has been replaced by Properties of Ecosystems, which has a Biblical perspective.
• Kingdom Tales, a classic collection of 36 beloved tales that use allegory to reveal truths about the Kingdom of God. Updated by My Father's World to include discussion questions.
• Expanded 7th & 8th Grade Supplement Package.
• 7th & 8th grade lesson plans included each week in the Teacher's Manual.

New or updated materials, all scheduled in the Teacher's Manual
• Parent/Teacher Supplement
• Properties of Ecosystems (replaces Wild Places)
• Classroom Atlas (replaces Intermediate World Atlas)
• Children's Atlas of God's World (replaced Illustrated World Atlas in 2014)
• God Speaks Numanggang
• 7th-8th Grade Supplement
• Kingdom Tales
• Currency Kit (added in 2014)

Purchase One per Student:
• Student Sheets
• Flags of the World (sticker book)
• Passport
• Exploring World Geography (or may photocopy)

2nd/3rd Graders, consider adding
• The Complete Book of Animals

Additional details summarized from Message Board conversations over the years:

1. Classroom Atlas: The Rand McNally atlas has changed covers, page numbers, and names (Intermediate Atlas) over the years. These changes have been mostly cosmetic, for instance moving the illustration of the geography vocab from the front to the back. Usually you can add or subtract 4-6 pages from the Lesson Plan page numbers and find where you should be all year.

However, the 2016, 13th edition has been more of a major change. When I personally compared the two atlases, it seemed that only the intro material, the North America intro, and the section on the USA are extensively lengthened. From Canada to the end of the atlas, the information appeared basically the same. Just be sure you start on the correct continent.

As far as evaluating any changes within the maps in various editions, in order to decide whether you want to update, you could look for Serbia/Montenegro (called Yugoslavia before 2003) and the Southern Ocean (named in 2000-2002), or search for Wikipedia's "List of World Map Changes" and check the most recent 21st century list.

2. Children's Atlas of God's World :
  • The former Illustrated World Atlas was the tall, DK-style Usborne book with the large toucan bird on the cover and a green border around the front. It contained paragraphs on each continent’s natural resources etc. It went out of print.
  • The new Children’s Atlas (mid 2013) focuses more on “God’s world” and specifically covers all the countries studied in ECC. This can be used with older manuals by finding the pages that match the country/continent being studied.
3. The Living World Encyclopedia: This is now an MFW version. The MFW website states, “My Father's World has had the privilege of influencing secular publishers to edit the content of their books. Walking along-side these publishers, MFW's editorial team has been able to change evolutionary language to more neutral language acceptable to most audiences. The primary change in many rlistttesources is to simply change phrases like ‘millions of year ago’ to ‘many years ago.’”
4. Properties of Ecosystems: Besides the textbook, note that the questions and the answers for POE were added to the ECC Teacher's Manual when the 2nd edition was released in 2009 (these are from the Teacher's book for POE, not sold by MFW). The POE text went to 4th edition in 2016.
5. Properties of Ecosystems Student Sheets: If you are using an older edition of ECC (prior to 2009) with the previously scheduled science books, you can just skip the new science sheets; there were no student sheets for the previous science books, but instead science notebooking was assigned.

6. Student Sheets: Current sets can be used with all previous editions of ECC.
7. Teacher's Manual: The 7-8th grade grid in 2nd edition (2009) makes a manual upgrade especially valuable for families who will have 7-8th graders. In 2013, Teacher's Manual covers were changed to reflect the Discover/Investigate/Declare stages. Print dates will give you the best idea of whether the page numbers in your Manual will match the page numbers in various books used in ECC which may be changed by publishers at various times.
8. Flag stickers: These have changed over the years. Originally used for the passport only; later placed on world maps in a sticker book as well; in 2020 a page of flag stickers was added to Student Sheets, and the Flags of the World Sticker Book is an additional activity that can be shared by the family.
9. Window on the World: Older editions can be used by locating the "topic" (people group or type of religion), rather than just page numbers.
10. Exploring World Geography: Now blue, this book was formerly purple and called World Geography, but no other changes have been noticed. Update: The blue cover with MFW logo is issued as the 3rd edition, 2014. Minor changes that do not affect assignments have been spotted, such as the Southern Ocean mentioned in the Basic Geo Vocab at beginning of book.
11. Currency Kit : This was added in 2014. The kit includes "money" for each country visited in ECC. This "money" was created by My Father's World to introduce students to the look of the currency in each country. The kit is printed in color and will contain enough for 5 students. Older manuals do include the suggestion to find currency samples online and use them as you enter each new country and "stamp" the student's passport.
12. Fast Facts was also added in 2014. Be sure to include math facts practice in some way.
13. 2017: (a) Student Sheets: Flag pages in Student Sheets are now in color. Current Student Sheets work with all previous manuals.
(b) Teacher's Manual: LLFT lesson numbers were added to weekly grids and the nonfiction portion of Book Basket was updated.
(c) Kisses From Katie replaced Peace Child in the 7-8th Grade Supplement. If you have a 7th or 8th grader, you could use either book during those weeks.
14. World Facts and Landmarks Flashcards were in early versions of the 7-8th grade package (2009-2010) but were discontinued by the publisher. You might find similar memory challenges at websites such as Quizlet.
15. Hymns were in the 2007 ECC manual. After that year, the author decided to keep hymns in their historical time period in the last 2 years of the cycle.
16. MFW help sheets were sometimes included with new materials when first added (e.g. when MFW first started using the flag sticker book, or when the ECC 7th & 8th grade suggestion page came out). Those help sheets were also in the new manuals and are no longer needed.

Updates - 1st vs. 2nd Edition decisions, also using 2nd time

Unread post by cbollin »

momto2grls wrote:I purchased ECC (brand new) to use next year with a 3rd grader. I would love to upgrade, but don't know if I want to spend the money. Is it doable if I just purchase the additional books for the upgrade without the updated TM?
Well, that's a hard question to answer. If you use first edition, you'll be fine. You don't have to get anything from 2nd edition in order to have a really good program. I've done first edition twice.

*if someone has a 7th/8th grader, I really think 2nd edition manual will be very important and worth it. Now, I did the ECC with 7th grader without the benefit of Marie's grid, so I know it is doable without it, but I am very glad that others after me will have it scheduled for them (this doesn't apply to you now, but maybe down the road...)

*the 2nd edition manual has a lot more helps and hints in it for research and using the program. Also, I like how book basket is now at the back of the manual by weeks, instead of listed before each continent.

*Other items from 2nd edition:
I think the ecosystem book might be harder to do on your own without scheduling (but that is a guess of mine). So if you don't use it, it's ok.

the optional Complete Book of Animals looks like it would be easy enough to coordinate without manual because much of the book is arranged by continent and it is optional not required.

Kingdom Tales (the new read aloud). It is a book of allegory and MFW is including questions to help parents get the most out of the book. I know some of the time it is used when Hero Tales is not scheduled, and when other read alouds aren't going on. Then again, I've never done this book and used ECC two times.

You can buy just the Parent Supplement and the Student Sheets. It will help cut back on prep time with the geography game, Chinese checkers, map work, and student appendix pages. From the little bit I looked at it at my convention this past weekend, I think those things could probably be used with first edition manual without too much overwhelming stress on mom.

Get the passport books. They are really good and only $1.25. It will just make it easier on you and you'll have something pretty and fun. first edition tells you when to do the passport and all of that, but now you have a quick ready made book to use. I bought a cheap one at a local craft store and really liked the ease of use. and the MFW passport book is sooooooo much nicer than what I got at craft store.

Get the book on Bible Translation -- You'll have to figure out how and when to use it, but I'm confident that would be worth it even if you did some extra work to schedule it.

I don't know if that helps or not. But it is possible to buy just the new stuff and then try to schedule it yourself with some extra work. Price it out and don't overspend.

Posts: 200
Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2008 7:27 pm

ECC Country Ideas not always lining up with 2nd Edition

Unread post by doubleportion »

Just a note. I was looking at the country ideas board for ECC. We are in week 2. After looking on the board, I kept looking for the xylem experiment in week 2 TM and couldn't find it. I finally leafed ahead and found it in week 8. I don't know what other things might have been rearranged in 2nd Edition. But I thought the ECC users for this year with 2nd edition might want to be aware of that as they look at the Country Ideas Board. I was confused by it at first. Then I thought maybe it had been removed in the 2nd edition. I was happy to find it in week 8. Looks like a fun experiment and very do able for this non-sciencey mom.


ECC Upgrade Question

Unread post by cbollin »

amylynn12 wrote:Can anyone tell me what is in the parent/teacher supplement? Are there big changes in the second edition? I am not able to purchase the full upgrade & just wondered if I would be completely lost if I continued using the first edition and just purchased the parent/teacher supplement. Thanks so much for any help. :)
Hi Amy,
I'll say what little I know about the 2nd edition parent supplement. It has map masters, one copy of the pre made full color geography game, and the Chinese checkers game. So, it's a way to have that geography game done, or a master version in color of geography game for other children to model while making their own in first edition.

do you need that for 1st edition? maybe... it can be helpful on the geography game and optional Chinese checkers in one of the weeks. I've done 1st edition twice and still don't have the parent supplement.....

If you have 1st edition, it should be ok to use.

If you have the books that match your 1st edition manual, you won't be lost. If you need help on the jr. high stuff in 1st edition.... I'm sure there are some classic posts around here somewhere.
amylynn12 wrote:I do have a Junior High dd that is using it. I'm sure we will get through it, too. The second edition sure sounds great how it has the info written in for the junior high students.

Are there lesson plans for the book God Speaks Nummanngangg? Do we just read through it? I may have to pick that one up. :)
for God Speaks Nummanngang...

if you get that book and have 1st edition, here is my idea.
*read through it together (10-15 minute and you're done with it)
*read it again the next day.

*Try to keep it out when you are starting Cam Townsend book. Tell kids: remember when we read this book (GSN)? Well, it talked about Bible translators. We're going to learn about a famous person in Bible translation...

*consider putting it back out in basket or coffee table during Australia. The book is about a people group in Papua New Guinea, so let's just call that Australia and Oceania instead of Asia and say close enough.

There are ideas in the book about how you and your family can help with translation projects through MFW"s mission fund, God's Word for the Nations.
It's a sweet book that David Hazell wrote. It's geared toward children and sounds like a missionary telling the story of some of his friends because that is what the book is. I'm thinking of picking up extra copies of that book to perhaps share at our new church. I bet some of the kids would like to know the story since one family in the congregation is going to work for Pioneer Bible Translators.


Which do you prefer and why?? ECC 1st or 2nd ed.?

Unread post by cbollin »

4littlehearts wrote:Besides the fact that the 7th and 8th grade stuff is all scheduled in, which ed. do you prefer and why?
background so my comments have any context. I used ECC in 2003 (it was the 2nd year I think? that it was on the market). I used it again in 2008-09 year. Then, at the end of that year, 2nd edition was released. I ended up getting 2nd edition/upgrade for some things I do on the internet..
So, I used 1st edition and had to schedule jr. high on my own (with help from Marie and Lucy and Bret at MFW office)
I own 3 ECC manuals (2003, 2008 1st edition both - don't ask me on that.. .I don't know why) and 2nd edition 2009. I'm weird. y'all know that by now.

My preference? 2nd edition.

*(the jr. high scheduling!)

*the student sheets are done for you! I had no problem copying as needed, and making my geography game --- but man o man... the colorzied version and pre made version is NICE! the newer John 3:16 sheets. nice. ok.. yes, you can buy the student sheets and use with 1st edition... but ....

*I liked Kingdom Tales. did I mention, I really liked that book and we were touched by it to see how much the King really loves us. To the King! To the Restoration!

*I'm thankful that a book on Bible translation was able to be added back in. The original first edition had a book What Language Does God Speak?, but it went out of print and for years there wasn't a replacement. Then, David Hazell wrote a book that fit Marie's goals. and it was ready in time for 2nd edition. Even if for some reason you go with 1st edition on used market or are using it again from a previous time (or whatever reason) --- consider getting God Speaks Numangang. to teach your children about Bible translation. Very nice replacement from the out of print Wycliffe coloring book from a long time ago...

*more extensive teaching notes in 2nd edition for things such as science, geography research sheets, a sample of a filled in Country Summary Sheet so your 7th grader and you can know what to expect and try for (sorry first born! I didn't ruin you!)

*oh yeah... more science in 2nd edition.

*book basket lists were moved to the back of the manual instead of at the beginning of each continent and sorted by week. in 1st edition -- the book basket list was in the front notes before each continent, and arranged by country name. It was still nice, but honestly, I like it in one place instead of before each continent.

*compared to the 2003 printing of first edition --- 2nd edition weekly grids look crisper and easier to read what was part of different subjects.

Now don't get me wrong --- I used 1st edition twice and I was fine with 1st edition. It was great both times. But I ended up buying 2nd edition manual and "upgrade parts" just to see it and to cyber chat and help... anyway.... if you get first edition, it is good. But I think 2nd edition is really good.

Julie in MN
Posts: 2876
Joined: Mon Jun 28, 2004 3:44 pm
Location: Minnesota

Re: Which do you prefer and why?? ECC 1st or 2nd ed.?

Unread post by Julie in MN »

4littlehearts wrote:Besides the fact that the 7th and 8th grade stuff is all scheduled in, which ed. do you prefer and why?
Hmmm., interesting question given that we were just discussing liking the "old way" of homeschooling over here: http://board.mfwbooks.com/viewtopic.php ... 335#p60335

I'm using 2nd edition ECC now, and we used 1st edition some 5 years ago. I like them both :) I even kept them both !!

The 1st edition was great for a 3rd grader, with very hands on, gentle science. So we did fine without the Ecosystems book, and we could have added Numanggang (sp?) some time during the early weeks of ECC. Kingdom Tales could have gone wherever Hero Tales wasn't scheduled, or even have waited for CTG or RTR. I liked making the game ourselves, because *I* learned a lot. So basically for me, 1st edition might seem fine for a 3rd-4th grader, although that child would likely repeat ECC in 7-8th, when they will definitely want the 2nd ed.

There are a few things that even in 3-4th grades, I would have liked about 2nd edition, though. I REALLY like the notebook cover in the 2nd edition student sheets. Seems silly to want one sheet, but notebooks are big at our house. Even though making the game was good for me, I could have skipped making the "game cards" and not been sad ;) I also like that each new year is going to have a few more things "fixed" such as a typo here or a library book there (e.g. MFW added Greenland to the North America game, because so many of us just wanted Greenland on there, even though it's not an independent country). And a few worksheets are improved or more John 3:16 pages added, for instance, is very nice. Not a big deal with MFW, but I"m kind of obsessive about such details (except I never minded the spiral being on my copies).

So for the younger years, It's all good (I just made a typo and wrote "it's all God" and realized that's true, too :)

(For upper elementary, 2nd edition is so worth it that I bought it even though I was keeping my 1st edition with all my old notes.)
Julie, married 29 yrs, finding our way without Shane
Reid (21) college student; used MFW 3rd-12th grades (2004-2014)
Alexandra (29) mother; hs from 10th grade (2002+)
Travis (32) engineer; never hs

Scheduling new materials with old edition

Unread post by cbollin »

Michelle in WA wrote:I have the 1st edition of the TM. I went ahead and bought Kingdom Tales & God Speaks Nuumangang. Now, where do I fit them in? They look like awesome books and I am sure we will enjoy them whenever we use them. I am equally sure that David & Marie scheduled them at a certain time for a reason. ;)

Read GSN the first week. read it a couple of times if you want. great intro to the need for Bible translation. pray.

My suggestion? consider reading it again some time when you do Cam Townsend book. and/or when you study Oceania.

KT: use it when other read alouds are not scheduled.

Julie in MN
Posts: 2876
Joined: Mon Jun 28, 2004 3:44 pm
Location: Minnesota

Re: Scheduling new materials with old edition

Unread post by Julie in MN »

I just had a few more details fresh in my mind, after having done ECC for the second time this spring.

(1) Numanggang could also be done in week 2 of 1st edition, where the God Speak coloring book used to be scheduled (if you have a manual as old as my first one).

(2) Even in 2nd edition, read-alouds don't start until week 2, in order to ease into the year. So don't feel obligated to add Kingdom Tales that first week, if you don't want to.

(3) KT is kind of read in "books." So the first book (Tales of the Kingdom) is read while there are no read-alouds, as Crystal mentioned, and it is finished before the missionary read-alouds start going for a while. I think it helps if you keep that first book together.

Probably no big deal, but my brain is full of tiny details :~
Julie, married 29 yrs, finding our way without Shane
Reid (21) college student; used MFW 3rd-12th grades (2004-2014)
Alexandra (29) mother; hs from 10th grade (2002+)
Travis (32) engineer; never hs
Julie in MN
Posts: 2876
Joined: Mon Jun 28, 2004 3:44 pm
Location: Minnesota

ECC 2nd Edition Differences

Unread post by Julie in MN »

HiddenJewel wrote:I am wondering what the differences between the 1st and 2nd editions of Exploring Countries and Cultures. Thanks.
I'll just copy-paste the list of items from the current edition & try to help:

Teacher's Manual, 2nd Edition - no longer has an appendix; has a new 7-8th grade grid
Parent/Teacher Supplement / Student Sheets - new, replaces the appendix & things you had to copy/make yourself such as the geography game
Flags of the World Ultimate Sticker Book - same, although this was added after we did ECC the first time, and the exact book changed over time
Passport - you use to make this yourself
World Geography - same, used to be used more for copying than it is now (geography game etc) and now is scheduled out for 7-8th grades
Hero Tales - same
Window on the World - same
God Speaks Numanggang - new, although there was a VOM coloring book in very old ECC editions
Illustrated World Atlas - same
Classroom Atlas - same, although editions have changed (including names)
Wall Map of the World - same
Maps and Globes - same
Geography from A to Z - same
A Trip Around the World - same
Another Trip Around the World - same
Properties of Ecosystems - new, replaces a much easier ecosystems book (Wild Places), which didn't have the Christian emphasis, and only covered 3 biomes
Living World Encyclopedia - same
Global Art - same
Wee Sing Around the World - same

Kingdom Tales - new, scheduled when no read-aloud was on the 1st edition schedule
Christian Heroes: Then and Now - same
Inflatable Globe - same
The Great Animal Search - same
Fun with Easy Origami - same, although it was added some time after we did ECC the first time
HiddenJewel wrote:Thanks, Julie!

Are there any significant changes to the actual schedule besides the appendix?
Yes, God Speaks and Kingdom Tales will be added. Properties of Ecosystems will be subbed. And some of the biome topics will be rearranged a bit. Now that POE is the main science text, it just makes sense to organize the biome study around that (although of course the biomes are still matched to the continents that best apply, such as studying rainforests as you learn about South America). Most of the old activities (celery experiment, tree activity on nature walk) will be in there but may be in a different week. POE also has worksheets and questions/answers that weren't in 1st edition.

Oh, and the whole 7-8th grid is new, with daily assignments all planned out (the suggestions were more general in 1st edition).

I can't think of anything else, but maybe someone who's doing it right now will know. There are, of course, minor tweaks such as typos fixed and possibly a few new book basket finds (as new books are published)?

Julie, married 29 yrs, finding our way without Shane
Reid (21) college student; used MFW 3rd-12th grades (2004-2014)
Alexandra (29) mother; hs from 10th grade (2002+)
Travis (32) engineer; never hs
Posts: 2
Joined: Thu Mar 24, 2011 6:49 pm

Re: ECC 2nd Edition Differences

Unread post by HiddenJewel »

Thanks, Julie. That gives me an a good idea of the changes enough to know I want for sure the 2nd edition.

Using old ECC, not 2nd edition

Unread post by cbollin »

Paulineha wrote:Hi everyone,
We've been using MFW since K and are finishing up 1850 to Modern Times. Next year I will have an 8th, 6th and 5th grader. I have the older edition of ECC, not the 2nd edition. Will this create problems with the 7/8th grade supplement, etc?
1. The things from the jr. high supplement to schedule are the biographies, but MFW has graciously listed that on the FAQ of their website. I'll copy and paste that... then you can pencil these in your old manual

  • What is the book schedule for the 7th and 8th grade supplement in ECC 2nd edition?
    The second edition Exploring Countries and Cultures schedules the books (and Progeny Press literature guides) as follows:

    Progeny Press literature guides - Weeks 1-8

    Bruchko (South America) - Weeks 9-11

    The Narrow Road (Europe) - Weeks 12-16

    Progeny Press literature guides - Weeks 17-22

    I Dared to Call Him Father (Asia/Pakistan) - Weeks 23-26

    Peace Child (Asia/Indonesia) - Weeks 29-34
2. jr. high students will do their science - MFW has lesson planners for Apologia jr. high programs. So, that will be separate.

3. research for World Geography Book... my daughter scheduled her stuff independently, but take a look at the online sample of 2nd edition to get one plan.. (work on it on T and TH)

4. research and write the Country Summary Sheets

5. and scheduling in a fuller Country Report. (might fit in the weeks between I Dared to Call Him Father, and Peace Child.... or what my family did, was do the report at the end of the year. We had to do 36 weeks of school in our state, so the last 2 weeks was devoted to writing the report after we researched during the weeks between Dared to Call Him Father and Peace Child.)

6. they do their own math, and language arts.

So, if you dont want to upgrade, you don't have to. They have a way to "upgrade" without having to buy everything. So make sure you call their office and get the details on that.

Using Properties of Ecosystems with 1st Edition ECC

Unread post by cbollin »

CyndyC wrote:I've got the 1st edition of ECC. I wondered if anyone had a list to line up Properties of Ecosystems with it.
Picking up my POE book this morning.... and looking at the table of contents of ECC online

I might try it this way:
week 1 and 2, try to get through lessons 1-4
week 3, 4, do the lesson 9, on forests.. (but save temperate forest for Europe and Rainforest for Brazil)
week 5, 6 lesson 19 would fit
Canada weeks... finish the "unit 1 stuff" and lesson 7 maybe...

then, from there, I'd look at the topics in 1st edition, glance in table of contents of POE and match things up. toward end of year. do other lessons that don't easily match...

sorry that's not a "do this" kind of schedule... but I think the ECC table of contents and POE table of contents... most things will line up "do this when you do that"

Posts: 318
Joined: Thu May 10, 2007 5:46 pm

Starting the 5year cycle over...got a couple ?'s

Unread post by dhudson »

overholt wrote:I'm looking at buying my things I need for next year, and I do not think that I want to update my ECC tm. I already have the geography game all made and laminated, so do I need the parent/teacher supplement? Or am I really missing out on something by not updating? Unless the Lord sends a miracle...this is my last time through with my four. I'll have an 8th, 7th, 6th and 4/5th grader.
I think that the 7/8th grade supplement grid was really valuable when we went through it the 2nd time. I did keep my laminated geography game from the first time but as I added students we needed more boards so the new ones worked well. It's not a must to update but it did make life easier.
God Bless,
blessed Mom of three - 16, 13 & 13
happy user of MFW since 2002

Re: Starting the 5year cycle over...got a couple ?'s

Unread post by MFW-Lucy »


Here is more information about what to do with a 7th/8th graders, http://board.mfwbooks.com/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=177. We would still recommend the 7th/8th grade supplement even if you do not have the 2nd edition. You will see the schedule for the books in the link above.

If you have more questions let us know.
Posts: 31
Joined: Tue Aug 09, 2005 4:12 pm

Re: Starting the 5year cycle over...got a couple ?'s

Unread post by Colleen »

Hi Laura,

I had similar questions last year. I decided not to upgrade for a number of reasons. First, I kind of liked having the hymns as part of ECC and the new edition doesn't have those. Second, I used the MFW plans for Saxon and Apologia to make a planner for my oldest. We also added our own schedule for the Applications of Grammar, Prodgeny Press guides, and the books that are in the new 7th/8th grade supplement to the planner. That covers most of what is in the 7th/8th grade grid as far as I know. Third, for me it helps to be able to make copies for my pre-schooler from the appendix rather than considering purchasing a whole set of student sheets for him. (I know that one doesn't apply to you). Last, I decided I was ok with my under 7th grade students "just" using the first edition ECC science rather than the more involved, possibly more time consuming, Properties of Ecosystems.

I also have a sentimental streak that didn't want to turn in my old manual for an upgrade, and a cheap streak that didn't want to pay full price!

Colleen (yes, the Colleen you know IRL!) :-)

One more thing. I was just informed the other day that there are some things in the first edition maps & geography game that have changed. The one I know of for sure is that there is now a Sudan and a South Sudan.
Colleen in MI
Wife to Dave (for almost 20 years) and Mom of four.
Currently doing:
US History to 1877 with 11th grade girl
Exp to 1850 (2nd time) with girls in 8th & 6th grades
First Grade (4th time) with only boy

Re: Starting the 5year cycle over...got a couple ?'s

Unread post by MFW-Lucy »

The student sheets can be used with the 1st edition which includes all of the maps already printed as well the Geography Game (you will need at least 2 that are the same if you go this route, so you may want the Parent/Teacher supplement so you will have the game too or follow along with one of your kids). Each child will need his own Geography Game. I do not know how many country changes have occurred since you last used ECC. Sudan and S. Sudan are only the latest changes. We also added more countries in the 2nd edition on the geography game. The maps are clearer than the ones that you will have to copy from Exploring World Geography (formerly World Geography) . There is also a flag for each of the countries and all of the country sheets have been updated with more detailed art,a map, a flag, and of course John 3:16 in the country language. Overall it is a lot less copying and prep work on your part. With some adaptation these can be used with the 1st edition T.M.

This is the only year in the 5 year cycle that we recommend 7th/8th graders read the assigned readings in science. This is important because it adds to the student's geography knowledge, but is not enough science for a 7th or 8th grader. We recommend adding General Science from Apologia (you can read more about this on our website under 7th-12th Science). The 2nd edition uses Living World Encyclopedia and The Property of Ecosystems for the science readings. The latter book was added to the 2nd edition for use with 4th-8th graders (and adapted for 3rd graders) because it gives more meat about this subject and is presented from a Biblical Worldview. It would probably take an average reader about 30-40 minutes to complete the weeks reading assignments from these two books in one sitting (or 10-15 minutes 3 days a week). Both include pictures as well as text and will not be a hard read for a 7th/8th grader. The other option is to have your 7th/8th graders sit in each day you read from science lessons for your 4th,5th, and 6th grader.

If you choose to add the Properties of Ecosystems you will need to look up the lesson to read each week in the table of contents, depending on the weekly topic in the 1st edition T.M.. If you have the student sheets you will be able to see the lessons marked on the weekly science sheets. Experiments do not have to be completed since a 7th or 8th graders will complete experiments in the Apologia science.

I am sharing this information with you so that you can make the most informed decision and what will be the best choices for your 7th and 8th grader completing this year. If you have not already done so you can view a sample of the 2nd edition T.M. on the website to see the weekly assignments laid out for 7th/8th graders. We understand that upgrading may not be in your budget, but you can still offer your 7th and 8th grader what they need using the recommendations in my post above. You can call the office at any time throughout the year, if you need any clarification or help working it out using the 1st edition T.M.

P.S .Colleen mentioned the hymns in ECC. I was reminded that the only year ECC had hymns was in 2007. The author decided to move these to the historical time period in the last 2 years of the cycle after that year.
Posts: 7
Joined: Tue Nov 07, 2006 10:21 am

Re: Starting the 5year cycle over...got a couple ?'s

Unread post by overholt »

Thanks for all the comments and suggestions. I really like the sound of the 7th/8th grade grid! I already have the Properties of Ecosystems book and student sheet cd-rom from AIG that I can easily add. I also didn't realize that Marie had posted some ideas for getting the most out of my first edition with my oldest two, thanks for the link, Lucy. Sorry, Colleen, I should have asked to see your layout again, or maybe you could help me work on one! :)
Happy to be Wife of One and Mother/Teacher of 4
Doing 2nd cycle Exploring with Countries and Cultures. Hudson (8th), Anna (7th),
Clayton(6th), and Victoria(4th/5th) :)
Julie in MN
Posts: 2876
Joined: Mon Jun 28, 2004 3:44 pm
Location: Minnesota

ECC 2nd ed w/ 1st edition books, etc

Unread post by Julie in MN »

momofsix wrote:I have an ECC TM c2009/rev Jan 2010... most of my books are the ones I used with the 1st edition 6 or 7 yrs ago.

The TM says to use the 2009 edition of Living World Encyclopedia. Can anyone tell me how much the book has changed (besides evolutionary content removed)? Also my classroom atlas is c2005. Think it'll work?

One more question: in the TM it lists "World Facts & Landmarks Flashcards" under 7th/8th grade supplement... I dont' remember seeing this on the website or in current catalog. :~ Know anything about this?

Thank you!!
Hi Elissa,
A Minnesota neighbor!

I used ECC in 3rd and 8th, with the 2 different manuals, but mostly the books I already had. Here was my experience, though a call to the office would always be the most current info (or maybe someone will who's using these during the current year).

1. Living World, I'm pretty sure you're right about the evolution-free content being the main change.

2. Classroom Atlas changes names on a regular basis, probably to insure you know you have the current version or the publisher wants to sell something that looks new? I had a "Classroom Atlas" and an "Intermediate Atlas," so in other words I bought the one I didn't have, and as I recall the vocabulary "picture" that I liked had moved from the front to the back but otherwise both were identical as far as I could tell. You might figure out what the newest world political map changes have been and see if yours is current. Let's see, doing a quick google... Wikipedia has a page called "List of world map changes" and the one that *to me* would feel the most outdated would be using the name "Yugoslavia," on maps before 2003, since there is no Yugoslavia any more.

3. We had the flashcards when my son did ECC in 8th (he's in 11th now, so 3 years ago). We did them after playing the geography game most times. I mostly used the World Landmarks ones, so he'd recognize a few famous landmarks. I'm not sure why they were discontinued. Sometimes things go out-of-print. I only see used ones on a quick internet search, so likely that is the case. If the idea interests you, there seems to be a similar list on Quizlet, which would be free :)

4. When we were doing ECC in 8th, I do remember wondering whether any of our other books had been updated -- for example, the populations on the geography worksheets, or even the fascinating facts in the Trip Around the World books. I remember thinking I should have just bought everything again, but on the other hand, I realized I didn't need the new atlas and could never even tell them apart when I went to the bookshelf to get ours, so maybe I was worrying for nothing. It might be worth a call to the office so you don't wonder like I did :)

Julie, married 29 yrs, finding our way without Shane
Reid (21) college student; used MFW 3rd-12th grades (2004-2014)
Alexandra (29) mother; hs from 10th grade (2002+)
Travis (32) engineer; never hs
Posts: 17
Joined: Wed Nov 12, 2008 4:28 pm

Re: ECC 2nd ed w/ 1st edition books, etc

Unread post by momofsix »

Wow thanks for even researching topics for me ... I'm feeling lazy anyway ;)
I may call the office ...I'm sure in the end it'll all work and not be worth worrying about like you said, right!? :-)
Elissa in MN (really mom of 8 ) 3 boys: 16, 10, 7 & 5 girls: 13, 11, 5, 4, 1
Using: God's Creation from A to Z, Exploring Countries & Cultures, World History & Lit, Math-U-See, Sequential Spelling, Rod & Staff English...and more
Bret Welshymer

Re: ECC 2nd ed w/ 1st edition books, etc

Unread post by Bret Welshymer »

Unfortunately the Landmark Flashcards were discontinued by the publisher.
Posts: 972
Joined: Thu Sep 20, 2007 11:43 am

Cycling back to ECC - bought in 2010 - update??

Unread post by TriciaMR »

asheslawson wrote:I purchased ECC in 2010 (manual is copyright 2002, 2009), and I purchased the student sheets then, for my daughter to do now, she was in K then, and entering 5th now. I didn't want my manual to be outdated an unable to use it again. I'm so glad I did, because money is tighter than ever this summer!

What is the parent / teacher supplement? Would there be any reason to purchase it, or is it strictly to accompany the new version?
The parent/teacher supplement has map masters, a geography game for mom/teacher, and a Chinese checkers game. I got it the second time around because I didn't want to make my geography game again, it was so time consuming. If you like what you have, just keep the TM and books, so everything will line up.

If your dd likes the state report, then I would get the country report book.
Trish - Wife to Phil, Mom to Toni(18), Charlie(14), and Trent(14)
2014-2015 - AHL, CTG
2015-2016 - WHL, RTR
2016-2017 - EXP1850, US1877
2017-2018 - DE, 1850MOD
2018-2019 - College, AHL
My blog
Julie in MN
Posts: 2876
Joined: Mon Jun 28, 2004 3:44 pm
Location: Minnesota

Re: Cycling back to ECC - bought in 2010 - update??

Unread post by Julie in MN »

asheslawson wrote:I know that I need the "Flags of the World", and a new passport. I also plan to buy the currency kit since that was not available then and I am excited to see that. I'm assuming since I do not have the updated manual, that I can use the original atlas that I bought with the package then.

Lastly, has anyone really seen a compelling reason to update the manual and all replaced books? Since I have the student sheets and manual that I purchased in 2010 from MFW, and all the books, my guess is I really wouldn't need to. I think if I plan to purchase the consumable "Flags of the World", and passport, then I could just purchase anything else I want, but use my original guide.
I think your version will have the 7-8th grid, Properties of Ecosystems, God Speaks Numanggang, and Kingdom Tales, right?

The only changes I can think of since then are the Children's Atlas and the addition of a Currency Kit and Fast Facts. All of those should be pretty simple to slip into the right spot, or to skip if you want to use what you have.

As far as updating things you already have, I debated that when we re-did ECC, because maps do change over time, but I really found my concerns were unnecessary. The important concepts about the world remain the same.

However, if you want to look at your various atlases and maps and evaluate how current they are, Wikipedia has a "list of world map changes." Some are very obscure and some aren't even officially accepted. The most "major changes" that caught my eye were these, and as you can see they aren't critical information for most K-12 students :)

* 2011 South Sudan (Africa)
* 2006/2003 Serbia & Montenegro instead of Yugoslavia (Europe)
* 2002 tiny East Timor (Asia)
* and around 2000 the Southern Ocean, but it isn't even included on all maps

Julie, who likes maps but couldn't keep them straight until teaching ECC
Julie, married 29 yrs, finding our way without Shane
Reid (21) college student; used MFW 3rd-12th grades (2004-2014)
Alexandra (29) mother; hs from 10th grade (2002+)
Travis (32) engineer; never hs
Posts: 211
Joined: Tue Oct 05, 2010 1:37 am

Re: Cycling back to ECC - bought in 2010 - update??

Unread post by asheslawson »

Hi Julie! You are funny - I am the same way - wanting to know what's the most correct! Actually - it was teaching ECC that I learned the Southern Ocean had been "added" to our previous list I learned in school! I'm glad to have the list you added - I'll check those. I am considering grabbing the new atlas - because it just looks wonderful!

My manual does have 7th-8th grid, I do have Prop of Ecosystems, God Speaks Numanggang, & Kingdom Tales, and I bought fast facts 2 years ago. I'm planning to purchase the currency kit, the passport, and a new flags sticker book.

Thanks for sharing the place to check those changes - I will check those out and add sticky notes to my atlas so I can point those out to her! It will probably open some dialogue for how things change in this world continually, often due to politics and / or disagreements between people - but isn't it wonderful how God doesn't change!
"So then, just as you received Christ Jesus as Lord, continue to live in Him" Colossians 2:6
dd-28, ds-25, ds-24, ds-22, ds-14, dd-10, student 13, granddaughter 3
MFW K, 1st, ECC, CTG, RTR, EX1850, 1850-MOD
Julie in MN
Posts: 2876
Joined: Mon Jun 28, 2004 3:44 pm
Location: Minnesota

Geography packets?

Unread post by Julie in MN »

arosemalone wrote: Wed Sep 21, 2016 8:15 pm I have noticed several mentions of geography packets being part of ECC as I read the archives on the subject of ECC. Have the packets been replaced with something else in recent years? I haven't found any packets in the ECC package. Or are the packets made by the teacher later in the year? We are on week 3.
Geography Packets are the pages from Exploring World Geography that are done for each continent.

When ECC was first written, there were no already-printed Student Sheets. Families were making copies (or removing pages) from several resources (including creating all the Geography Game boards ourselves !! ). So, to distinguish the different things, the pages for one continent from Exploring World Geography were often stapled together or put in one folder and called a "geography packet."

Today, families have the convenience of pre-printed Student Sheets and often order multiple copies of Exploring World Geography, so I rarely hear the term geography packets except from us oldies (our family first used ECC in 2004) :)

Julie, married 29 yrs, finding our way without Shane
Reid (21) college student; used MFW 3rd-12th grades (2004-2014)
Alexandra (29) mother; hs from 10th grade (2002+)
Travis (32) engineer; never hs
Posts: 25
Joined: Sat Mar 23, 2013 10:23 am

Re: Geography packets?

Unread post by arosemalone »

Thank you! So if I read "geography packets," I can just think "Exploring World Geography pages," instead.
Post Reply